The Indian Experience by Indians and Non-Indians

for discussing science, relationships, religion or non-BK spirituality.
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john
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The Indian Experience by Indians and Non-Indians

Post by john » 18 Aug 2006

Worldpeace is sounds like you can be a valuble source of information for us Westerner ex-BK regarding Indian spiritual life. It would be interesting to find out what is unique to BK and what is just a general practise amongst Indian spiritual organisations.

Is BK generally known throughout India?

How common is the usage of the word Baba?

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Post by worldpeace » 19 Aug 2006

john wrote:Worldpeace is sounds like you can be a valuble source of information for us westerner ex-BK regarding Indian spiritual life.
It would be my pleasure share my experience and whatever I know and can and it is fascinating to learn the experience of westerner BK/PBK/ex-BK experience. Rather than posting a big essay I would restrict myself small postings with the flow of the thread as I am a bad writer.
john wrote:It would be interesting to find out what is unique to BK and what is just a general practise amongst Indian spiritual organisations.
There are so many spiritual organisations/cults/persons/leaders/gods in India, from the big cities to the remotest villages. Most them have crazy ideas/concepts (to me, would be to any thinking person) and real crazy actions like; breaking the cocunut over the head for washing your sins, dancing in front of the idol to invoke/please God for a favour, piercing bodies, and just to whatever the so called guru/priest/divine-being asks to (they exploit people financially/sexually). As I said its part of the national psyche ... we need to fed upon something religious/spiritual.

Even if I speak Gyan to them, I too would be a guru one day. Market analysis says there lots of demands for gurus. :wink:

There are some niche groups serving the rich (they too need to be fed) like Jaggi Vasudev. And every major group has a dedicated team to market to/serve the rich and the influential. More the money, more the access to the gurus. There are some genuine Sanyasins too, wanderers, I must say that I myself would like to study them. Never did get any chance.

I would like to mention something very relevant, there is a tribe which just does Yoga on the light form of Shiva and nothing else, at a Shiv temple in South India. There might be such tribes at other places too. One BK brother explianed that there will be so many people who will be export-ready to Satyug when they come to Gyan. These tribes might belong to them. BKs differ from most others in the concept of God and Drama cycle. Everybody speaks of soul. In this perspective, for the laymen who keep coming and going out, BK is just another spiritual organisation
john wrote:Is BK generally known throughout India?
Not exactly. I know there is lot of work being done for Prathyakshatha. But with so many organisations around, the recall value is almost lost. BKs are quite popular in the cities. Towns/villages, definitely not as far as I know except for a few.
john wrote:How common is the usage of the word Baba?
Baba is a Hindi word. In North India, where Hindi is predominant, it is very common to refer to a fatherly figure, elders and even the priests. In South India, Baba is popularised by the siritual Gurus (Sai Baba) and it has come to refer to only spiritual gurus and lately attained a negative view with so many calling themselves Baba found to be culprits of exploitation and cheating, especially in the South.

Same can be seen within the BKs, North Indians immediately accept the word Baba to refer God. South Indians (including me) are initially reluctant to accept the word for God but later get used to and it becomes natural.

Disclaimer : All stated views are entirely mine and doesn't reflect any of the persons/organisations mentioned above. :)

(nobody cares for this in India) :lol:

Peace

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Bhavna

Post by bansy » 19 Aug 2006

Worldpeace,

What you have written is truly fascinating. Especially with the coconuts. :shock:

When in Madhuban and at centres, I "hung around" with the local BKs, who were always kind to speak to me in their best English. I often prefered to eat in the local section rather than that section labelled for double foreigners. If you ask, you can even help out in the kitchen or packing toli, instead of rushing to a class. And if you can get an English Murli in hand, you can sit in the Hindi Murli class, which are held immediately after Amrit Vela for those serving in Madhuban. During these times, there is something about the word "bhavna" which just feels so warm and melting feeling. Worldpeace, how can you explain bhavna from an Indian perspective ?

One of my favourite and funny, but loving, gesture is the shaking/nodding of the head side to side, a way of listening and affirming. The head seems to be on a spring. But the eyes stay focused on your eyes. Is this part of bhavna.

Worldpeace, you should also tell us of how you feel with the presence of westerners in India. We have much to learn. This is a forum not just spiritual matters but experience, and that involves the cultures of all involved.

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Post by worldpeace » 21 Aug 2006

I am sorry for the delay. Was caught up with lokik (well ... the lokik/alokik difference has to merge :D ) work.
there is something about the word "bhavna" which just feels so warm and melting feeling. Worldpeace, how can you explain bhavna from an Indian perspective ?
Bhavana - It means Expressions(Loosely used to mean "feelings" also)
Sadh Bhavana - Good Expressions
One of my favourite and funny, but loving, gesture is the shaking/nodding of the head side to side, a way of listening and affirming. The head seems to be on a spring. But the eyes stay focused on your eyes. Is this part of bhavna.
Yes this is part of Bhavana. In Indian culture it is very natural to people nodding when they are listening to other and/or saying "hmmm ... hmmm ..." This is to show that we really care for and interested in the person.
Worldpeace, you should also tell us of how you feel with the presence of westerners in India. We have much to learn. This is a forum not just spiritual matters but experience, and that involves the cultures of all involved.
Surely Sister Bansy.I too would like to explore more about western culture, their views/attitudes on all things - spiritual/worldly, their way of life and so on.

Westeners are generally viewed as very rich, intelligent people in India. People really keep them in high pedestal and they are clearly treated in "posh" manner than an Indian on same capacity in the industry. Basically we too accept that, because we are used to the harsh conditions (queues, congestion, heat, poor food, poor roads and all) but the Westeners are not. Hmmm ... hospitality is our national culture, especially in the rural areas. I myself am awed by the hospitality I get when I go to the rural places. For the rural people city bred/modern people are Westeners ... some one of higher breed. In this way too I am blessed to have the experience of both worlds, as I am basically from a very remote village and now settled (albeit for the time being) in a city.

But let me be frank ... increasingly, very well educated Indians have developed so much self esteem that they (we ... me included :wink: ) think that we can now compete with Westerners well. (The world is flat)

My colleagues are Americans, I really enjoy interacting with them, though mostly official. It gives me a great insight on their thinking and their attitudes. I really appreciate their work ethics. At times I really feel bad on my colleagues's (American) state. He himself has to train me on his work and eventually transfer his role to me. Its a real bad state for anyone to be.

I would like to know how Westeners think on Indians? Outsourcing? communism? WTO?

Admin/Others,

Please advise how do we develop this thread of understanding cultures. Should we take one broad topic/issue or a set of questions and go on?

Peace

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Cultural differences

Post by sparkal » 10 Jan 2007

I may not be qualified to say a lot, but will give my tuppence worth anyway.

The Supreme Soul emerged in India, does that mean that God is Indian? Of course not. Does it give Indian people the right to lay any claim to God, the Father of all souls? No. I have observed an infantile thing in the Indian personality/culture. It may come from purity and innocence, it may be the result of going from child- like, to child-ish. And then there is the art of turning every situation into one of chaos. My description of India might be that of organised chaos, but they get there eventually. There is much corruption in India, don't kid yourselves otherwise.

India is passive, female, I have never known it to invade another country, while the west is aggressive and predatory and tends to invade other cultures, leave them standing, then turn the people of that culture into slaves. Complex Parasites. India has a more self sustaining awareness, while the west operate a none self sustaining culture, one which therefore has to feed on others. Cultural carnivores, obscene to the hilt. While there is much flesh eating in India, the bodily constitution has come from a vegetarian source from years gone by. In the west, there will have been less eating of meat than now. Cold environments tends to bring about more meat eating of course as it is Yang or, gives heat. And there is the genes thing. The price is a more aggressive competitive and fearful culture.

India, until you start growing organic brown rice (white rice with the husk left on) you will continue to weaken the body constitution. I don't have much experience with south east Asia so won't comment. Like India, they seem to have forgotten that God is a being with personality. The meat eating Muslim and Christian cultures have retained this awareness of God being a being. Or is all this the handy work of the secret society fiddling with scriptures?

The Murli has said that the west will show the east. This to me suggests that the original souls of the Yagya, many of who are seeds cast to the wind, will return with a more refined and palatable form of Raja Yoga. It may also explain why westerners are given priority during Murli season. Authority on the basis of body type/ culture is an outrageous lie. Of the 108, many will currently be outside India. Only the Mother and Father have received a number, and neither of them are in India right now. many of the 8/ 108 may be outside India therefore, because Shiva is a universal spiritual being who comes to serve all souls, all souls are the spiritual children of God, none more special than the other. The question now is, how do we get from where we are to where we are going?, one harmonious world culture. God is not Brahmin. God is what we aspire to be like.

I would not rule out the possibility of a simple virus wiping out those with certain genes in their body, indeed, "war of the worlds" ends in this way, one of their favourite regurgitation's. Their choice, either share it, or lose it. It is not within their predatory nature to do so. "The meek shall inherit the earth" Your choice. The monkey will run off with the butter, your choice, share it or lose it. May the world become peaceful. Please sit for 1 minute and give powerful thoughts to bring this about. True cosmic ordering, instead of this selfish nonsense which is doing the rounds.

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Post by freefall » 10 Jan 2007

I find something very interesting and strange in comments about India. Either it is romanticized as a place of spirituality and purity or codemned as a benighted place full of superstitions and corruptions. People fail to appreciate that it is a large country and any superficial generalization based on the concept of male-female principle or Yin-and-Yang or veg. vs. non-veg. are bound to be erronneous. If Murlis make some generalized remarks about west showing path to east or east showing path to west, remember, they are as likely to be erroneous as any other generalizations.

It will be much easier and accurate to treat India as just another country -- different and unique, just like others. Better in some respects and worse in others -- just like any other country on the globe.

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Post by mr green » 10 Jan 2007

I agree completely freefall, India is just another location.

There are different cultures all over the world ancient or otherwise. It's great in some ways and stinks in others just like everywhere else.

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Post by sparkal » 11 Jan 2007

We can see that the worlds land mass was one, and how it has fragmented, and continues to do so. Imagine what is was like when it was one land mass with no borders.

I agree, India is just another country, part of this one I am in even, part of all countries.

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Re: The Indian Experience by Indians and Non-Indians

Post by bansy » 20 Aug 2008

I would like to revitalise this topic and hope more Indian based members will contribute.

I am interested in the idea of "bhavna". A recent event at the Olympics may have demostrated this, regarding the opening ceremony when a little girl was singing the opening song, I am sure many people around the world felt some affection to a small child cheerfully singing in front of billions. A sense of purity, innocence, cuteness. So without doing anything, the bhavna from people's heart warmed to this soul.
But how it can easily all be turned wrong when it was discovered that the child was not singing but was miming whilst another child was singing over in the background.

What is western bhavna and what is eastern bhavna ?

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