Meaning of Avaykt Bap-Dada.

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Roy
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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Roy » 26 Feb 2011

Sach_Khand wrote:Even those poor BKs I suppose must have given the same answers to the so called PBKs when they used to literally hunt them down as per the directions of Virendra Dev Dixit.
Fair comment Sanjeev Bhai... and as long as Shivsena Bhai is totally easy with the beliefs he has, he is at least in his own eyes, doing what is right. Just as i believe Baba Dixit was right to do what he did at the time, regarding trying to inform BKs, that they hadn't got the whole picture or understanding, of Raj Yoga.

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by arjun » 27 Feb 2011

sachkhand wrote:Even those poor BKs I suppose must have given the same answers to the so called PBKs when they used to literally hunt them down as per the directions of Veerendra Dev Dixit.
The above statement of the above member is not true as Baba has directed the PBKs that they should try to give Godly message to any person not more than three times. It is said in the Murlis that if someone belongs to our clan he will understand just by receiving the message. First of all most of the BKs who hate PBKs or are trained by their teachers to have that attitude don't even say Om Shanti to PBKs so how can the PBKs hunt them down? It is only the BKs who give a positive response who are given Godly message by the PBKs.

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by arjun » 27 Feb 2011

sachkhand wrote:Even those poor BKs I suppose must have given the same answers to the so called PBKs when they used to literally hunt them down as per the directions of Veerendra Dev Dixit.
Not a true statement from a member whose name on this forum means 'abode of truth'.

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Roy » 28 Feb 2011

arjun wrote:The above statement of the above member is not true as Baba has directed the PBKs that they should try to give Godly message to any person not more than three times. It is said in the Murlis that if someone belongs to our clan he will understand just by receiving the message. First of all most of the BKs who hate PBKs or are trained by their teachers to have that attitude don't even say Om Shanti to PBKs so how can the PBKs hunt them down? It is only the BKs who give a positive response who are given Godly message by the PBKs.
Thank you for this clarification of the matter Arjun Bhai. It seems clear to me, that the PBKs were only being serviceable in their actions.

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Sach_Khand » 28 Feb 2011

arjun wrote: The above statement of the above member is not true as Baba has directed the PBKs that they should try to give Godly message to any person not more than three times . It is said in the Murlis that if someone belongs to our clan he will understand just by receiving the message. First of all most of the BKs who hate PBKs or are trained by their teachers to have that attitude don't even say Om Shanti to PBKs so how can the PBKs hunt them down? It is only the BKs who give a positive response who are given Godly message by the PBKs.
arjun wrote: Not a true statement from a member whose name on this forum means 'abode of truth'.
Two responses. First to falsify my statement. Next to discredit me. O.K.

So what did Virendra Dev Dixit mean when he used to tell about Ram.
Ram fail hua, phir usko Gyan ke teer aur kaman miltey hain. Inse shikar karo aur kamao khao. (in English, Ram failed, then he gets arrows of knowledge and bow. With this hunt and earn and eat. PLS NOTE: these are not exact words, but Virendra Dev Dixit has used the words kamao khao meaning earn and eat using your arrows of knowledge. And he has explained the body to be the bow. And he also talked about its flexibility. These I have heard in the audio cassettes which used to be recorded in the early 1990s and possibly even before.)

Be it once or thrice. If you are running behind a person even after he shows no interest in the beginning itself, even the first arrow of knowledge is nothing but hunting. We too are using the arrows of knowledge here. But here we are not forcing or running behind aynone against his/her wish. It is not possible here. Even if someone writes something, we have the choice not to read it. I have myself experienced how some BKs whom I knew used to feel when I went to them to give advance knowledge. Even for the first time. They used to feel as if I am a dacoit who has come to loot them. I could feel that unwelcome atitude of theirs. And that's it. If I give advance knowledge to them or use the arrows of knowledge then that means I am hunting them. So, I stopped this so called service.

I am not saying that sharing knowledge is wrong. But running behind someone even after his displeasure is a kind of hunting. Be it the first arrow of knowledge or third. And do not try to lie. You cannot. There are words of Virendra Dev Dixit which says hunting and earning.

:neutral:
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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Roy » 28 Feb 2011

Sach_Khand wrote:I am not saying that sharing knowledge is wrong. But running behind someone even after his displeasure is a kind of hunting. Be it the first arrow of knowledge or third. And do not try to lie. You cannot. There are words of Virendra Dev Dixit which says hunting and earning.
I tend to agree with this... if someone is running away from you, then perhaps it is a sign to leave them alone. In my own personal circumstances, i have in the past, tended to push my point of view too hard(in general), and too many times... only to find that this created resentment, rather than building bridges; so am sensitive to this argument you put forward Sanjeev Bhai. Although Baba Dixit's instructions, may have been mis-interpreted by some, who may have been a little over zealous in the application of them. Aren't we always supposed to feel the pulse of souls before embarking on service? However, a question. If someone is about to commit suicide, do you just let them get on with it, or do you save them from themselves? If souls(your brothers) appear to be committing spiritual suicide(at least from your point of view), do you not keep trying to help them, until you realise the task is futile? I think this is an important point, and i welcome eveyone's views on this.

I watched a modern interpretation of the Mahabharata, about 20 years ago, in which someone asked Krishna, why he bothered to try and warn others of the folly of their actions, knowing full well they wouldn't listen. I cannot remember the actual answer, but it was something along the lines of, he had to do it anyway!

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by nivi » 01 Mar 2011

Roy Bhai,

In response to your post above, I would just like to share my experience.. I think when I am following shirmat(Godly directions), dharna, and have complete faith in Baba and Murlis, than the results of seva are very powerful and has effect on others..

If we just give knowledge without us being an example how can others listen to us? People are naturally attracted to purity.
Baba always says with purity comes unity. In any organization if there is purity it keeps people united and in agreement with each other.
Baba also says Gyan should be heard from Kanya(Sister) and Mothers because they follow more dharna and have more purity than brothers. You must have also heard ' Vijay mala ka awahan karo'... Supposdly the head of Vijay mala is sister BK Vedanti she is also know as 'Choti Mummy' or 'Queen Bee'. Wherever the Queen bee goes the other worker bees flock with her in a big group..Such is the power of purity. These are the Queens of Bharat, who for many, many birth followed purity and kept only ONE husband all of their lives and many births and sacrificed their lives to protect the purity of their bodies.

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Roy » 01 Mar 2011

nivi wrote:In response to your post above, I would just like to share my experience.. I think when I am following shirmat(Godly directions), dharna, and have complete faith in Baba and Murlis, than the results of seva are very powerful and has effect on others..

If we just give knowledge without us being an example how can others listen to us? People are naturally attracted to purity.
Baba always says with purity comes unity. In any organization if there is purity it keeps people united and in agreement with each other.
Baba also says Gyan should be heard from Kanya(Sister) and Mothers because they follow more dharna and have more purity than brothers. You must have also heard ' Vijay mala ka awahan karo'... Supposdly the head of Vijay mala is sister BK Vedanti she is also know as 'Choti Mummy' or 'Queen Bee'. Wherever the Queen bee goes the other worker bees flock with her in a big group..Such is the power of purity. These are the Queens of Bharat, who for many, many birth followed purity and kept only ONE husband all of their lives and many births and sacrificed their lives to protect the purity of their bodies.
Great post Nivi, your point about purity is very important... what is more serviceable, than a powerful stage of purity!

Roy

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by arjun » 01 Mar 2011

sachkhand wrote:I am not saying that sharing knowledge is wrong. But running behind someone even after his displeasure is a kind of hunting. Be it the first arrow of knowledge or third. And do not try to lie. You cannot. There are words of Veerendra Dev Dixit which says hunting and earning.
The instuction about giving Godly message at the most three times does not mean giving it to a person who is not interested to listen. It is applicable only in case someone is interested to listen. As roy Bhai said we have to feel the pulse.

As regards the word hunting, it is not an invention of PBKs. These words are popular even among BKs as Avyakt BapDada has used this very often. Transmission of Godly message through BKs is also called hunting by Avyakt BapDada. BKs must be aware that it is often mentioned in the Avyakt Vanis that Pandavas are hunters (shikaris) who hit the arrows of knowledge and bring the hunted person (i.e. the person who is interested in knowing BK knowledge) to the BK sisters (i.e. Shaktis). So, if the same point is applied to PBKs giving message to the BKs, what is so strange about it?

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Roy » 01 Mar 2011

arjun wrote:The instuction about giving Godly message at the most three times does not mean giving it to a person who is not interested to listen. It is applicable only in case someone is interested to listen. As roy Bhai said we have to feel the pulse.

As regards the word hunting, it is not an invention of PBKs. These words are popular even among BKs as Avyakt BapDada has used this very often. Transmission of Godly message through BKs is also called hunting by Avyakt BapDada. BKs must be aware that it is often mentioned in the Avyakt Vanis that Pandavas are hunters (shikaris) who hit the arrows of knowledge and bring the hunted person (i.e. the person who is interested in knowing BK knowledge) to the BK sisters (i.e. Shaktis). So, if the same point is applied to PBKs giving message to the BKs, what is so strange about it?
Imo, there is a word that doesn't get used a lot, but is vital when undertaking anything in life, and that is balance. Arjun Bhai's excellent clarification, is an example of balance, where chasing after BK brothers who do not want to listen to you, has no place. Thank you for these balanced words Bhai.

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Sach_Khand » 02 Mar 2011

arjun wrote: The instuction about giving Godly message at the most three times does not mean giving it to a person who is not interested to listen. It is applicable only in case someone is interested to listen. As roy Bhai said we have to feel the pulse.
I agree. No comments.
arjun wrote: As regards the word hunting, it is not an invention of PBKs. These words are popular even among BKs as Avyakt BapDada has used this very often. Transmission of Godly message through BKs is also called hunting by Avyakt BapDada. BKs must be aware that it is often mentioned in the Avyakt Vanis that Pandavas are hunters (shikaris) who hit the arrows of knowledge and bring the hunted person (i.e. the person who is interested in knowing BK knowledge) to the BK Sisters (i.e. Shaktis). So, if the same point is applied to PBKs giving message to the BKs, what is so strange about it?
So, Arjun agrees that my statement was not a false statement.

Virendra Dev Dixit has issued directions with the words hunting. I am not debating on where was the word "hunting" first used. I just wrote that poor BKs can give the same reply as written by Roy when the so called PBKs try to literally hunt them on the directions of Virendra Dev Dixit.

I think Arjun should not have explained my nickname and write that my statement was a false one.

:neutral:
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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by arjun » 03 Mar 2011

sachkhand wrote:So, Arjun agrees that my statement was not a false statement.

Veerendra Dev Dixit has issued directions with the words hunting. I am not debating on where was the word "hunting" first used. I just wrote that poor BKs can give the same reply as written by Roy when the so called PBKs try to literally hunt them on the directions of Veerendra Dev Dixit.

I think Arjun should not have explained my nickname and write that my statement was a false one.
No, I don't agree with the above Member. His statement was indeed a false one. Despite my clarification he is still using the word 'hunting' in a literal or derogatory sense rather than a metaphorical sense. If that is the case why is he or shivsena Bhai on this forum? He supports shivsena Bhai so much. But he has never objected to shivsena Bhai repeatedly raising the same point although everyone is very well aware of his philosophy and have requested him several times not to repeat the same statement again and again. He never used the above words 'literally hunting down the PBKs' for shivsena Bhai. This shows that he has a clear prejudice towards the PBKs.

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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Sach_Khand » 04 Mar 2011

arjun wrote: No, I don't agree with the above Member. His statement was indeed a false one. Despite my clarification he is still using the word 'hunting' in a literal or derogatory sense rather than a metaphorical sense.
I mean when I write that PBKs literally hunted BKs. And this mistake has been done by some BKs too. And I think, it is better we accept our mistake instead of arguing.
Arjun might be a very smooth and sophisticated gentleman in his approach in doing service. But not all.
It is not just words. Even the vibes of Virendra Dev Dixit on hearing him directly or through his cassettes made some of his followers to become harsh and angry on seeing BKs. And this has been told to me by one of the ex-follower of Virendra Dev Dixit.
arjun wrote: If that is the case why is he or shivsena Bhai on this forum? He supports shivsena Bhai so much. But he has never objected to shivsena Bhai repeatedly raising the same point although everyone is very well aware of his philosophy and have requested him several times not to repeat the same statement again and again. He never used the above words 'literally hunting down the PBKs' for shivsena Bhai.
That question is foolish. It is better Arjun stops seeing this forum. This forum is for discussing the BK knowledge, although it is interpreted differently by so called PBKs and people like me. We are here to share our views. This is not an official site of Virendra Dev Dixit and his followers and not their launchpad.
Why should Shivsena or myself give away our views just because someone like Arjun does not agree with it. We are expressing our views. We are not forcing Arjun to read our replies or posts or answer them. Literally we cannot do it. I not even know who is Arjun personally.
arjun wrote: This shows that he has a clear prejudice towards the PBKs.
I openly accept that I do not consider Ak to be true.There are good questions raised by AK. But I do not agree with all the explanations given by Virendra Dev Dixit to those questions. If this is being prejudiced, then I am.

:neutral:
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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by Sach_Khand » 04 Mar 2011

arjun wrote: Transmission of Godly message through BKs is also called hunting by Avyakt BapDada. BKs must be aware that it is often mentioned in the Avyakt Vanis that Pandavas are hunters (shikaris) who hit the arrows of knowledge and bring the hunted person (i.e. the person who is interested in knowing BK knowledge) to the BK Sisters (i.e. Shaktis). So, if the same point is applied to PBKs giving message to the BKs, what is so strange about it?
I think Arjun had made himself perfect in putting words in someone's mouth. And this is not the only case. Many times he has tried to twist the replies of myself and others too, whom he think not agreeing with PBKs. He is always finding chance to make an issue by twisting the replies.

Just read his objection. And read my reply to Roy where I used the words "literally hunting".
I quote my reply, "Even those poor BKs I suppose must have given the same answers to the so called PBKs when they used to literally hunt them down as per the directions of Virendra Dev Dixit."

I have not questioned hunting by PBKs. What I have questioned is the reply given by Roy to shivsena's post regarding Shivsena as a a warning to them (so called PBKs) all, of what can happen when doubts are allowed to flourish (as in Shvisena)!

But this Mr. Arjun has picked the word "hunting" and has started doing Ph.D in that word. Like by whom was that word first used and how and in what meaning was that used by Virendra Dev Dixit and possibly it can continue further.

Dear Arjun, you might have free access to internet. But I have to pay Rs. 15 per hour. So please stop such foolish questioning.

:neutral:
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Re: Meaning of Bap-Dada

Post by arjun » 04 Mar 2011

sachkhand wrote:Dear Arjun, you might have free access to internet. But I have to pay Rs. 15 per hour. So please stop such foolish questioning.
For the kind information of the above Member I would like to state that I do not have free access to internet. I work for my livelihood and pay for internet from my hard earned money (which of course belongs to ShivBaba, I am just instrumental).

As regards the rest of the comments made by him, I can only say that he can continue to defame Baba Virendra Dev Dixit, PBKs and AK as long as he is allowed to be Member of this forum by its Admins. I have no objection.

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