Is Shiv a separate soul?

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Roy
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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by Roy » 13 Jun 2011

Sach_Khand wrote:We are here to make a new start. And if you still want to continue with the old things then there is no meaning in new start and all the forum changes. Make up your mind once and for all. Do you really want the same kind of forum or would let bygone be bygone and have a new start.
Dear Sanjeev Bhai

I am not sure a new start is possible, it is simply business as usual. Only now it has been officially restricted, to the debating section of the forum. I think I am going to make a fresh start though, and stop butting in and answering for other souls. :D
Sach_Khand wrote:I think you have lost your mental balance and are writing things which are having no connections at all.
I must say, that you appear to have wandered into a bit of a double standard, by saying this. If someone had said this to Shivsena Bhai, you would complain about it being too personal.

Perhaps we all need to take a deep breath, and chill a little! :D I think i may take a break from posting for a while, as I am getting a little jaded, and feel like I am losing my perspective.

Peace, my brothers(and sisters)!

Roy

sita
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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by sita » 14 Jun 2011

Dear Sach_Khand,

Yes, i believe Paramdham, Mulvatan and Shantidham is one and the same, that is being depicted in different ways, like the many names for Ishvar, Bhagvan etc.

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by Sach_Khand » 14 Jun 2011

sita wrote:Dear Sach_Khand,

Yes, i believe Paramdham, Mulvatan and Shantidham is one and the same, that is being depicted in different ways, like the many names for Ishvar, Bhagvan etc.
Dear Sita,
Since PBKs claim that they have with them The Supreme Teacher Shiv, I have stopped writing my views. Now I too would like to hear from them what they have to say. I am ready to become student of AIVV once again. Let them prove what they want to tell. I have written a post regarding MulVatan, ShantiDham and Paramdham. I request you to post your questions there. Hope they will give you correct answers to all your querries.

:neutral:
Sanjeev.

sita
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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by sita » 18 Sep 2012

As regards : "I do not come in heaven."...for whom is it said??....is it for Shiv bindi (whom no one can see and confirm that he has gone to heaven or not).
I feel that it is said for ShivBaba(no. 1 shivshakti-Mama) who never goes to Vaikunth (heaven) as it is said in Murlis "ShivBaba hai swarg ka rachieta" and rachieta(creator) ShivBaba never enjoys his own rachna(swarg)...heaven is created for children to enjoy.(not for ShivBaba)...also in Bhakti marg Maa adi-shakti jagdamba(personified ShivBaba) is never associated with heaven....this is how i see the whole concept of Shiv and ShivBaba.
Dear shivsena Bhai,

Does it mean you believe Mama is not going to heaven?

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by shivsena » 18 Sep 2012

sita wrote: Dear shivsena Bhai,
Does it mean you believe Mama is not going to heaven?
Mama is personified ShivBaba and ShivBaba does not go to heaven (according to Murlis).
In Murlis it is said: "ShivBaba toh sirf brahmand ka malik hai..tum bacche brahmand aur vishwa ke malik dono bante ho."
"ShivBaba hai swarg ka rachieta"(not swarg ka malik)

In Bhakti-marg also, ShivBaba(Mama jagdamba) is never shown in heavenly world.
shivsena.

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by sita » 18 Sep 2012

Who is then along with Krishna in Satyug?

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by shivsena » 18 Sep 2012

sita wrote:Who is then along with Krishna in Satyug?
Whosoever is Krishna and Radha in Satyug..will they know that they are Krishna and Radha??...so why talk about them, when they themselves will not know who they are and what purusharth they did in Sangamyug.
Also satyugi Krishna and Radha are not described in scriptures..all rememberences are of Sangamyug....so let us concentrate on 'who is who' in Sangamyug

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by sita » 18 Sep 2012

So the soul of Mama goes back to Paramdham after the end of Sangamyug? And when does she come to the drama? At the beginning of Sangamyug?

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by shivsena » 19 Sep 2012

sita wrote:So the soul of Mama goes back to Paramdham after the end of Sangamyug? And when does she come to the drama? At the beginning of Sangamyug?
IMO, There is nothing like jad Paramdham in space...all i know that Shiva(zero) and shakti(one) are never seperated and what happens after Mama is revealed as "Bharatmata shivshakti avtaar" is just speculation and not yet clear to me....as i said before, i do not have all the answers and the re-search is still going on.

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by Roy » 22 Sep 2012

Dear Shivsena Bhai

“Father (Shiv) alone establishes the pure family cult after coming down on earth. That is why four arms have been shown for Vishnu - Parvati(Sita) with Shankar(Ram), and Saraswati(Radhe) with Brahma(Krishna).” [Mu 23.01.90]

Who do you think ShivBaba was referring to when he said Saraswati in this instance?

Roy

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by shivsena » 23 Sep 2012

Roy wrote:Dear Shivsena Bhai

“Father (Shiv) alone establishes the pure family cult after coming down on earth. That is why four arms have been shown for Vishnu - Parvati(Sita) with Shankar(Ram), and Saraswati(Radhe) with Brahma(Krishna).” [Mu 23.01.90]
Who do you think ShivBaba was referring to when he said Saraswati in this instance?
Roy
Dear roy Bhai.

We have already discussed that the 4 arms of Vishnu do not represent the 4 souls as described by adv-Gyan...according to Murlis the 4 alankars of Vishnu are for the final stage of 108 brahmins, where each brahmin will numberwise get the alankars as per his purusharth.

To revise, according to adv-Gyan, the chakra represents Saraswati.....so which are the 3 arms representing Ram-Shankar and sita-parvati and Brahma-Krishna ??

shivsena.

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by arjun » 24 Sep 2012

Shankh (conch shell) = Head of vijaymala (Confluence Age Lakshmi)
Chakra (discus) = Saraswati
Gadaa (mace) = Brahma Baba
Padma (lotus) = Jagdamba
The head/body = The soul of Confluence Age Ram/Narayan.

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by shivsena » 24 Sep 2012

arjun wrote:Shankh (conch shell) = Head of vijaymala (Confluence Age Lakshmi)
Chakra (discus) = Saraswati
Gadaa (mace) = Brahma Baba
Padma (lotus) = Jagdamba
The head/body = The soul of Confluence Age Ram/Narayan.
This means 4 alankars and 5 souls....has this been mentioned in any Murli.
What had Brahma-Lekhraj Kirpalani done in his life to deserve a mace (symbol of strength)....he just maintained the Yagya financially....he never understood what the Murli said and he never had the strength to control the children after Mama's demise.

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by Roy » 24 Sep 2012

shivsena wrote:What had Brahma-Lekhraj Kirpalani done in his life to deserve a mace (symbol of strength)....he just maintained the Yagya financially....he never understood what the Murli said and he never had the strength to control the children after Mama's demise.
Dear Shivsena Bhai

Here is a quote about this subject, based on ShivBaba's clarifications...

"The mace is represented by Brahma Baba because he remained steadfast in sustaining the Yagya in the beginning while the soul of Prajapita Brahma left the Yagya because of differences with Brahma Baba and also left his body. But Brahma Baba continued to sustain the Yagya until the same soul of Prajapita takes rebirth and comes back to the Yagya to take charge. Since Brahma Baba remained steadfast in the battleground, he is represented by the mace in the picture of Vishnu."

I believe that the soul who is no 1 in all aspects of Gyan is Prajapita-Ram, and he is represented as the head and body of Vishnu. His 4 cooperative arms may not be as powerful as him, but they play great parts of cooperation that are symbolised by the ornaments of Vishnu.

Roy

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Re: Is Shiv a separate soul?

Post by arjun » 25 Sep 2012

shivsena wrote:This means 4 alankars and 5 souls....has this been mentioned in any Murli.
If everything is mentioned in Murlis then why would ShivBaba say in the Murlis that He will keep on narrating new things till the end? Neither Dadi Gulzar nor your imaginary Om Radhey Mama's part is narrating any new points. So, please don't criticize just for the sake of criticism.
What had Brahma-Lekhraj Kirpalani done in his life to deserve a mace (symbol of strength)....he just maintained the Yagya financially....he never understood what the Murli said and he never had the strength to control the children after Mama's demise.
But as long as he was alive, the Yagya was united. But where is your imaginary Om Radhey Mama since 1969? When you yourself don't know where and how she is playing her part in this world, then why do you criticize others?

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