Why Virendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

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shivsena
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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by shivsena » 28 Nov 2012

arjun wrote:Shiv does not get ranked like human souls. This is why He has been shown separately.
Whatever happens in Sangamyug is remembered in Bhakti-marg...so according to PBKs, shiv is revealed as combined shiv-Shankar in Sangamyug, so why is shiv seperate from the 1st bead Ram aka Shankar in rudramala ??

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Re: Why Virendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by Roy » 28 Nov 2012

shivsena wrote:Whatever happens in Sangamyug is remembered in Bhakti-marg...so according to PBKs, shiv is revealed as combined shiv-Shankar in Sangamyug, so why is shiv seperate from the 1st bead Ram aka Shankar in rudramala ??
Both Shiv and Shankar are revealed at the end... Father reveals son, son reveals Father... these two incorporeal souls are revealed through the one body of Shankar, and in this way they are combined. Two separate elements form the one compound, known as Shiv Shankar Bholenath... this compound cannot exist if either element is not present.

But when it comes to the Rudramala, of course Father Shiv is going to be separate from Ram, they are two entirely different souls(elements or spiritual atoms)... One is the Supreme Father of all souls, Shiv, the flower... the other is the no 1 or supreme human soul Ram, the first bead.

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by shivsena » 22 Dec 2012

Virendra Dev Dixit will imply in his teachings hundreds of times that he is Ram-prajapita brahma-Shankar-ShivBaba-Sangamyugi Narayan-Vishnu etc etc, but will not speak openly...is there so much difference in silent speech and overt speech that he becomes God if he remains silent and he becomes shaitan-hiranayakashyap if he openly admits it.....does implying indirectly through his teachings or speaking directly, are they not the same !!!

Truthfulness and fearlessness go hand in hand...if -Virendra Dev Dixit is really prajapita brahma(Father of humanity) and he admits it openly, then all arguments, all enmity and silent hostility will end and peace will be restored in the Godly family(that is what God incarnates for)...unless of course his part is to spread peacelessness in Sangamyug.

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Re: Why Virendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by Roy » 22 Dec 2012

shivsena wrote:Virendra Dev Dixit will imply in his teachings hundreds of times that he is Ram-prajapita brahma-Shankar-ShivBaba-Sangamyugi Narayan-Vishnu etc etc, but will not speak openly...is there so much difference in silent speech and overt speech that he becomes God if he remains silent and he becomes shaitan-hiranayakashyap if he openly admits it.....does implying indirectly through his teachings or speaking directly, are they not the same !!! Truthfulness and fearlessness go hand in hand...if -Virendra Dev Dixit is really prajapita brahma(Father of humanity) and he admits it openly, then all arguments, all enmity and silent hostility will end and peace will be restored in the Godly family(that is what God incarnates for)...unless of course his part is to spread peacelessness in Sangamyug.
You claim Virendra Dev Dixit ji is implying that he is Ram etc; but PBKs believe that it is Godfather Shiv Himself who is narrating through him(Virendra Dev Dixit), which is an entirely different thing. But God will not claim Himself to be God, because anyone could do this and so what is proven. It is only when Ram(Virendra Dev Dixit) becomes equal to Him, that Godfather Shiv gets revealed to the world(Shivjayanti)... the proof lies in the spiritual attainment of Ram and the 108; it is they who reveal Him at the end. It would make no difference to anyone's faith, if Virendra Dev Dixit ji claimed to be Prajapita Brahma... it perhaps may in the short term for some; but recognition has to come through knowledge and understanding by each one; that is how the Sun Dynasty souls are distinguished from other Brahmins. Once Prajapita-Ram(Virendra Dev Dixit) becomes 100% subtle or incorporeal(the complete angel Shankar), the guessing game will be over, but not before.

"ShivBaba(Father Shiv) is subtle(incorporeal). Similarly Shankar is also subtle(i.e. he attains the 100% soul conscious or incorporeal stage equal to Father Shiv's by the end of the Confluence Age... hence the name at practical Revelation, of Shiv Shankar Bholenath)." [Mu 29.09.77]

"Father had explained that Prajapita Brahma, who is a bodily being now(i.e. an effort maker soul)... he only becomes subtle(100% incorporeal, like Father Shiv at the end, whilst remaining in his corporeal body - this is the angelic stage of Shankar)." [Mu 23.01.84]

"When Prajapita Brahma who is corporeal now (i.e. making spiritual efforts), becomes complete(100% soul conscious), destroys all his sins, then he becomes an angel(called Shankar - a King within his old degraded body)." [Mu 20.01.78]

"Shankar(the complete angelic stage) will not be called Prajapita(the corporeal effort maker part), too. Shankar’s part is once (i.e. Shankar aka Prajapita-Ram, only achieves this stage at the end, once - whereas the part of Prajapita is split into two parts - at the beginning of the Confluence Age in Ram's 83rd birth, and the second part from 1969/70 in his 84th birth, until the end)." [Mu 06.09.92]

"Angels mean kings of the physical body." [Av 05.02.09]

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by shivsena » 29 Dec 2012

To all pbk brothers.

Murli 12-5-67 says: "Jo apne-aap ko Ishwar mante hai, woh bade bade hiranya-kashyap hain."[ "Those who consider themselves as God are biggest hiranya-kashyap."]

The above Murli spoken before 1969 clearly forsees the future happenings in the Yagya when souls like -Virendra Dev Dixit, Dashrath, Nagraj etc etc. would start preaching that they are living God(Baba) and has warned the souls to be aware of such hiranyakashyap souls.

shivsena.

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by arjun » 29 Dec 2012

if -Virendra Dev Dixit is really prajapita Brahma(Father of humanity) and he admits it openly, then all arguments, all enmity and silent hostility will end and peace will be restored in the Godly family(that is what God incarnates for)...unless of course his part is to spread peacelessness in Sangamyug.
He will never admit that he is medium of God, but will ultimately be revealed as the medium of God. Until then you can keep on defaming him like mbbhat.

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by shivsena » 29 Dec 2012

arjun wrote:
He will never admit that he is medium of God, but will ultimately be revealed as the medium of God.
-Virendra Dev Dixit preaches openly in his teachings that he is living God and so according to the Murli point he is bade te bada Hiranaya-kashyap....whether he admits it openly or not, it does not make any difference to me or any logical person....it may make difference to PBKs...let PBKs interpret the Murli point as per their thinking..but to me the message in Murlis is loud and clear.

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by arjun » 29 Dec 2012

OK you are free to have your opinion.

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by shivsena » 29 Dec 2012

Yes--Each soul is free to have his own opinion about Murli/Vani points and that is what is going to decide his fate. (Mu: "The whole emphasis is on study"..."saraa madaar padayee par hai.")

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by shivsena » 30 Dec 2012

arjun wrote:
Until then you can keep on defaming him like mbbhat.
It's too early to say who is defaming whom ?...My part is to oppose the teachings of a dehdhari guru and your part is to defend your guru...if your guru is revealed as ShivBaba, then i would have definitely defamed ShivBaba...but if your guru is not revealed as ShivBaba, then you (and other staunch PBKs) would have defamed ShivBaba by calling a Ravan-partdhari-Virendra Dev Dixit as ShivBaba...i hope you are aware of this.

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by shivsena » 06 Feb 2013

Murli 13-5-82 says : "Atma sharir dwara bolti hai na. ShivBaba bhi kahte hain main bol saktaa hun. AANE SE HEE BOLNAA SHURU KAR DETAA HUN.
[ "Soul speaks through the body..ShivBaba also says that I can also speak...The moment i come i start speaking. (the knowledge)]

The above point clearly says that the moment ShivBaba comes he starts speaking...if shiv entered Virendra Dev Dixit in 1969 then the moment Virendra Dev Dixit came in knowledge he should have started speaking the knowledge...but he became a student first and then did manthan and then started giving his manmat....so how can Virendra Dev Dixit be ShivBaba ??

shivsena.

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Rjildrene: Why Virendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by Roy » 06 Feb 2013

shivsena wrote:Murli 13-5-82 says.. "Soul speaks through the body..ShivBaba also says that I can also speak...The moment i come i start speaking(the knowledge). The above point clearly says that the moment ShivBaba comes he starts speaking...if shiv entered Virendra Dev Dixit in 1969 then the moment Virendra Dev Dixit came in knowledge he should have started speaking the knowledge...but he became a student first and then did manthan and then started giving his manmat....so how can Virendra Dev Dixit be ShivBaba ??
Father Shiv comes twice in the form of the Father... firstly in 1936/7, and then again in 1976/7, 40 years later. As soon as he enters Prajapita in 1936/7, He clarifies the meaning of Dada Lekhraj Brahma Baba's visions... and once Baba Dixit has gained complete faith in 1976/7; He once again begins to speak in the form of the Father, directly to the Brahmin children. So the Murli point could be interpreted to say; the moment I come in the revealed form of the Father, i start speaking knowledge directly to the children.

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by arjun » 07 Feb 2013

shivsena wrote:The above point clearly says that the moment ShivBaba comes he starts speaking...if Shiv entered Veerendra Dev Dixit in 1969 then the moment Veerendra Dev Dixit came in knowledge he should have started speaking The Knowledge...but he became a student first and then did manthan and then started giving his manmat....so how can Veerendra Dev Dixit be ShivBaba ??
Roy Bhai has given a correct reply, but even if your statement is taken in a literal sense, the above Murli point is applicable to 1969 as well. Although Shiv entered in Baba Virendra Dev Dixit in 1969 itself, but nobody recognized Him at that time. He even started speaking by raising doubts about the basic knowledge that was given to Baba Virendra Dev Dixit by the BKs. But the BKs of that period could not recognize Shiv's role through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit. It was only after the year of revelation of the Father in 1977 that the Father Shiv started speaking to children who recognized His new role.

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Re: Why Veerendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by shivsena » 07 Feb 2013

So according to roy Bhai and arjun Bhai, ShivBap takes 2 births in Sangamyug...but Murli 20-4-06 says: "Tum bachhey punarjanma may aatey ho, mai nahee aata". [meaning: you children come in rebirth, i do not come in rebirth"]...so how come adv-Gyan teaches that shiv takes 2 births in Sangamyug(once in 1937 and then in 1969.)

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Re: Why Virendra Dev Dixit cannot be personified ShivBaba.

Post by Roy » 07 Feb 2013

shivsena wrote:So how come adv-Gyan teaches that shiv takes 2 births in Sangamyug(once in 1937 and then in 1969.
You could say Father Shiv takes more than this, because we know he also comes in Brahma Baba Krishna, and Jagadamba Gita Mata. There are 4-5 Brahmas shown in the scriptures i believe, and we know from the Murli, that anyone Father Shiv enters is to be called Brahma. But Father Shiv never takes a body of His own, so there is no question of re-birth anyway... and Shivjayanti in a practical sense, refers to Father Shiv's revelation to the world at the end, which only occurs once. The point you have mentioned could also refer to human souls going through the cycle of faith and faithlessness, which is something Shankar doesn't experience, once he attains complete faith in 1976.

"I enter him who has that role fixed in drama and the title Brahma is to be attributed to him again. If He comes into another person, his name will also be given Brahma." [Mu 10.03.78]

"Shankar(Prajaita-Ram) is beyond the cycle of birth and death(i.e. he never loses faith after 1976)." [Mu 04.05.00]

"Shivjayanti(revelation of Father Shiv in practical form, through the corporeal body of Shankar aka Prajapita-Ram) means the effort of children comes to an end." [Av 06.03.97]

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