The PBK Party and 1997 events

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arjun
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Post by arjun » 04 Apr 2007

So do you believe it will be possible for someone to find Mama and have a talk with her or is this speculation? What about email, is she contactable via email?
Had it been so easy to contact Mama, the questions about Mama's whereabouts would not have been raised repeatedly in so many discussion CDs.

As far as I know Mama's email id (if it exists) is not known to almost all PBKs (including me).

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Post by shivsena » 04 Apr 2007

John wrote:So do you believe it will be possible for someone to find Mama and have a talk with her or is this speculation? What about email, is she contactable via email?
Dear john Bhai.

Nothing in this world is impossible; even IMpossible says I M possible. If it was impossible then i would have straightaway written to you that no one should ever try to find Mama. If one has a strong will then one can find a way; but as arjun Bhai correctly pointed out that finding Mama and talking to her is the most difficult task and only a few determined souls can undertake this task and the real test of nischay begins only after you meet her and talk to her.

As arjunbhai has said, no one in Advance Party has her email ( if at all it exists).

shivsena.

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john
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Post by john » 04 Apr 2007

but as arjun Bhai correctly pointed out that finding Mama and talking to her is the most difficult task and only a few determined souls can undertake this task. As arjunbhai has said, no one in Advance Party has her email (if at all it exists).
Shivsena
Have you met Mama after she left the PBKs?
and the real test of nischay begins only after you meet her and talk to her.
Are you saying Mama has lost complete faith and when a PBK finds this out, it will be a big test of their faith?

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Post by bansy » 05 Apr 2007

Want to go back to other issues relating to the topic thread :
shivsena wrote:Then came the year 1997, when Dashrathbhai and gang teamed up against Baba and made false allegations about rape and Baba was arrested and put in jail, and Mama went into hiding and the children were left alone to defend themselves and their parents; the whole happy Godly family was in total ruins and all PBKs (including mysef) were shattered internally. (Though on face, we put on a brave front and each one did his bit to free Baba from jail and put the family together). The next 4 months things were hell for everybody until Baba came out of jail on August 14th 1997; but things were never the same again. Differences started cropping up between Mother, Father and children about how to fight and solve the court cases of rape and income tax. The whole family was split into 2 groups; one teamed up with mother and other teamed up with Father; and both teams worked differently with no communication with each other. The degeneration and disintegration of the Advance Party had begun, slowly but surely.

This went on, until there was a big sangatan in Calcutta in the year 2000, where all PBKs from all over India gathered for one month, and that was the beginning of the Kaliyugi shooting in the Yagya. In discussion class, one PBK asked Baba about the purpose of this gathering and Baba answered that this was the Bhakti-marg shooting in the seed world. (Just as there were large scale gatherings in the BK world during their Kaliyugi shooting). Knowledge had taken a back-seat. For the first time discussion classes, question and answer sessions, were started after the morning class and that is when, after seeing the whole scenerio, my mind started reeling and it dawned upon me that even Advanced Knowledge is not the final truth. After reaching bombay, I started my research of the Murlis to find out what is amiss in the Advanced Knowledge.
Dear Brother Shivsena
I warmly welcome your experience and sharing of them. Could you elaborate more on these events (highlighted in bold). Please add what clarity to these preceedings. (Other PBKs can also reply of course)

1. "gang teamed up against Baba and made false allegations about rape"
What do you mean by "gang" and why would there be a rape allegation ?

2. "The next 4 months things were hell for everybody until Baba came out of jail on August 14th 1997"
What type of "hell" or disorder do you mean ?

3. "there was a big sangatan in Calcutta in the year 2000, where all PBKs from all over India gathered for one month"
What was the purpose and result of this gathering ?

4. "The whole family was split into 2 groups; one teamed up with mother and other teamed up with Father; and both teams worked differently with no communication with each other."
What happened and resulted from these 2 groups before and now ?

5. "For the first time discussion classes, question and answer sessions, were started after the morning class"
Was this a suggestion from the children ?

Thanks and regards
Bansy

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Post by shivsena » 05 Apr 2007

Dear bansy Bhai.

Your curiosity to know more about the Advance Party and its past in quite understandable; but i am sorry i cannot divulge any more than what i have already disclosed. If you are interested to know more than it would be better if you come to Kampil and do the 7 days course face to face and then ask all your queries.

OK Om Shanti.
shivsena.

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Post by arjun » 06 Apr 2007

Sister Bansy wrote:"1. gang teamed up against Baba and made false allegations about rape"
What do you mean by "gang" and why would there be a rape allegation?
Some ex-PBKs with the alleged indirect help of some BKs. They believed/believe that Shankar (Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) is impure and drinks the poison of sex-lust.
Sister Bansy wrote:"2. The next 4 months things were hell for everybody until Baba came out of jail on August 14th 1997"
What type of "hell" or disorder do you mean ?
Baba was in jail and Mama also became incognito. So virtually, there was no one to give directions except for the various suggestions of senior PBK sisters/brothers. So, PBKs were confused. Some PBKs joined hands with the newly formed Vishnu Party. Some surrendered PBK sisters went back to their lokik families. Due to the strong opposition from the public of District Farrukhabad (in particular villages around Kampil) it was difficult for PBKs to step into Kampil. And at that time there was no other mini-Madhubans in India except the Delhi one (not even at Farrukhabad). There were very few gitapathshalas located mainly in South India.
Sister Bansy wrote:"3. there was a big sangatan in Calcutta in the year 2000, where all PBKs from all over India gathered for one month"
What was the purpose and result of this gathering ?
The purpose was possibly to facilitate those souls to undergo bhatti (Advance Course), who could not visit Kampil. Further, it was also meant to facilitate a big gathering of PBKs from all over India, who could not meet at the same time due to the constraint of space at Kampil. The above event was historical for PBKs in a sense that the video recording of Baba's Murli classes began from there.
Sister Bansy wrote:4. "The whole family was split into 2 groups; one teamed up with mother and other teamed up with Father; and both teams worked differently with no communication with each other."
What happened and resulted from these 2 groups before and now ?
I don't agree with Shivsena Bhai's comments completely. Although there was some kind of a polarity in the PBK family, but it was not so serious/big enough to be termed a 'split'. Even during the times of Brahma Baba and Mama, it has been mentioned by ShivBaba in the Sakar Murli that some children have affinity for Mama and some for Baba (i.e. Brahma) but none cares for ShivBaba. Similarly, even before 1997, some PBKs had affinity for Mama (Kamala Devi Dikshit) and some for Baba (Virendra Dev Dixit) and some for both/ShivBaba. The affinity of some souls (who are in minority, including some surrendered sisters) for Mama became more visible after the events of 1997. But none of them left the PBK family to form any separate group. They are very much a part of the PBK family and undertake all the activities of PBKs collectively. But they may have some differences of opinion with regard to advance knowledge.
5. "For the first time discussion classes, question and answer sessions, were started after the morning class"
Was this a suggestion from the children ?
I don't know the answer to this question. But I would like to say that unlike Avyakt Vanis at Mount Abu, PBKs had been asking questions to ShivBaba (Through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) even during the Murli classes since a long time and vice-versa. When Baba started touring various places after the above-mentioned gathering at Calcutta PBKs used to sit with Baba even after the Murli classes and used to ask many questions, but these Q&A sessions did not used to be recorded on video camera. I have attended some such unrecorded Q&A sessions. Even many of the Murli classes could not be recorded on video because no PBK owned a video camera at that time.

It may be possible that when the number of unrecorded question and answer sessions started increasing, Baba may have decided to get it recorded so that he would not have to answer the same set of questions at every place. But in spite of nearly 250 discussion cds as on date, many PBKs still ask questions that have already been answered by Baba.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Post by fluffy bunny » 06 Apr 2007

arjun wrote:Some ex-PBKs with the alleged indirect help of some BKs. They believed/believe that Shankar (Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit) is impure and drinks the poison of sex-lust.
Excuse me taking this to the logical conclusion, having sex is not a crime in Kali-Yug. Rape is. It is a crime very difficult to gain a conviction for and, in India, a very difficult one to find anyone to come forward to report.

To make an allegation of rape there would have to be a victim, either male or female. Without that victim coming forward, there is no crime. Which victim came forwarded to make the allegation and on what grounds?
  • • How are the courtcases coming along? Any sight of the end?

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Post by bansy » 07 Apr 2007

Thanks for the replies Arjunbhai.

Unity is important within a group. The next step is to expand that unity amongst other groups. An ocean is formed from droplets of water that condenses from all corners of the world, accumulates, and all flows back to the ocean.

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arjun
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Post by arjun » 07 Apr 2007

ex-l wrote:To make an allegation of rape there would have to be a victim, either male or female. Without that victim coming forward, there is no crime. Which victim came forwarded to make the allegation and on what grounds? How are the courtcases coming along? Any sight of the end?
Some female PBKs had levelled such allegations about a decade ago when the Vishnu Party was formed.

But as far as I know and have been informed through discussion cds, those who levelled these charges do not appear in the Court on prescribed dates and thus the case keeps getting postponed/adjourned. I also heard that Baba Virendra Dev Dixit has been acquitted in some cases.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Post by shivsena » 08 Apr 2007

John wrote:Have you met Mama after she left the PBKs?
Dear john Bhai.

I do not know, how or not, it is going to affect anybody (whether i have met Mama or not), so i would prefer to let this remain a query only.

Anyone who leaves the Yagya and returns back to lokik life, is understood to have lost faith (actions speak for themselves), and when any pbk finds this out, it is obviously going to create a storm in his mind. (He will definitely question himself, that if this is the fate of the first surrendered soul to Baba, then what would be the fate of those who came long after 1983).

shivsena
.

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arjun Bhai and shivsena Bhai

Post by sakshi delhi » 30 Apr 2007

Hello brother,

I have read your some of posts and from that i have come to know that Mr. Dashrathbhai Patel has illegally blamed for destroying the PBK Party in about 1997. But this is not truth. In the name of Dashrathbhai Patel, some other people tried to destroy the PBK party.

f you do not know how much donation was given by Dashrathbhai Patel to Virendra Dev Dixit and Kamla Mata. Baba and Mama love very much Dashrathbhai Patel. But when he found some irregularities in the Yagya, then he left this party and got some new Gyan and then after started a new party. Until today they always remember Virendra Dev Dixit and Kamla Mata. They always try to save them even when blamed for such act. They have given advice to make a trust for income tax purpose but they have not impliment it.

Today, they also consider virendra dixit to be Shankar.

Please try to made bridge between Vishnu and sankar party. After that the work ends.

Thanks.

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Post by fluffy bunny » 30 Apr 2007

shivsena wrote:[Anyone who leaves the Yagya and returns back to lokik life, is understood to have lost faith (actions speak for themselves), and when any PBK finds this out, it is obviously going to create a storm in his mind.
Let me be the stormbringer ... I heard that 'Mama' had gotten married and had a child. I asked but no one gave me any confirmation. Now I have said it, can some tell me if it is untrue?

Its no big issue for me and it would be less of an issue if it was just answered and put to bed. Some of ife is always going to unknowable. Not even God Whoever know it all.

We should name the women that made the allegations as well inorder to put a stop to that; send out a powerful message to any BK that whatever they do, the world will know about it. ( ... which is actually a quote from a Murli!).

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arjun
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Post by arjun » 01 May 2007

ex-l wrote:Let me be the stormbringer ... I heard that 'Mama' had gotten married and had a child. I asked but no one gave me any confirmation. Now I have said it, can some tell me if it is untrue?
Dear brother,

Since you had posed the question to Bindi mata, I did not deem it fit to answer. Moreover, I have not met Mama since 1998. And I do not know her whereabouts. So, I am not in a position to answer this question. However, I have conveyed the question to Baba. But, since the question was addressed to Bindi mata, I don't know if Baba would answer it or not. Bindi mata or any other member who has met Mama in recent times may be in a position to answer.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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Dashrath Bhai & the PBKs

Post by abrahma kumar » 13 Aug 2007

Any PBKs willing to re-open the discussion of Mr. Dasrath Patel aka Dashrath Bhai and the incidents of 1997?

regards
Abrahma Kumar

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Post by yudhishtira » 14 Aug 2007

Also, can I ask that you do not use Hindu terms that some of us may not understand. For example, you talk about "Bhakti-marg" and different kinds of "marg" and "shooting". I've never heard of this in a Gyan context before and would appreciate pointing in the right direction if this has been defined elsewhere!

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