Swarg ke rachieta

An open forum for all ex-BKs, BKs, PBKs, ex-PBKs, Vishnu Party and ALL other Splinter Groups to post their queries to, and debate with, any member of any group congenially.
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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by andrey » 31 Oct 2008

Creator of Heaven is ShivBaba because he is always in the stage of soul-conciousnes. According to the Advance knowledge the meaning of swarag is to go into the stage of the self - swa, that is the soul. ShivBaba does not make any effort for to reach or maintain this stage.

In the Advance knowledge Lakshmi and Narayan are said to be creators of Heaven because they practically do the effort to reach the stage of soul-conciousness through which they become transformed to L/N and become masters of the world.

Laksmi and Narayan who are masters of Heaven could be said for the souls of Radha and Krishna and when the world has already become heaven. L/N from the Confluence Age are creators of heaven because they live in the Confluence Age when heaven is practically created, they live when the world is transfromed, they create means they transform themselves.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by new knowledge » 01 Nov 2008

Dear arjunbhai, is the picture of Lakshmi & Narayan valid for the Sangamyugi period (before 2036) or the Satyugi period (after 2036)? As according to you, Satyugi Radha-Krishna takes birth in 2036, shouldn't the Picture of Lakshmi & Narayan be valid for some (Satyugi) period after 2036? Then, why that Lakshmi & Narayan are entitled as Sangamyugi n\, as the period after 2036 is not that of the Sangamyug? And, why are Lakshmi & Narayan shown with Shankh, Chakra, Gadaa & Padma (which are assumed to be Sangamyugi symbols) after 2036?

And, if that picture is valid for the last period of the Sangamyug (before 2036), why Radha-Krishna in corporeal form are shown in that picture, as they are assumed to take birth in 2036?

In short, how does the Sangamyugi Lakshmi & Narayan & the Satyugi Radha-Krishna appear at the same point of time in the same Picture of Lakshmi & Narayan?

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by arjun » 06 Nov 2008

shivsena wrote:Is there any Sakar Murli which says that "satyugi Radha-Krishna are the twin children of Sangamyugi Lakshmi-Narayan.(Murlis always say that ''Radha-Krishna hi Lakshmi-Narayan bante hai'')
Although it is not directly said so, but it is mentioned that Krishna and Radha are world prince and world princess. If their parents are not world emperor and world empress, then how can their children be world prince and world princess?
Now why is it so that all the fundamental teachings of Advanced Knowledge are contradictory to what the Sakar Murlis say. (Creation Lakshmi-Narayan becomes Creators according to Advanced Knowledge and ShivBaba is ignored as creator.)
The fundamental teachings of advanced knowledge are not contradictory to what Sakar Murlis say. Just as you interpret Ram and ShivBaba to be one personality, just as you interpret Maya to mean the soul of Krishna (which is nowhere mentioned directly in the Sakar Murlis) the advanced knowledge is an advanced interpretation of Sakar Murlis.

Lakshmi and Narayan are not creations. They are the creators of heaven. ShivBaba is not ignored as the creator because the Confluence-Aged Narayan becomes creator only when the incorporeal Shiv enters in him in the Confluence Age.
new knowledge wrote:is the picture of Lakshmi & Narayan valid for the Sangamyugi period (before 2036) or the Satyugi period (after 2036)? As according to you, Satyugi Radha-Krishna takes birth in 2036, shouldn't the Picture of Lakshmi & Narayan be valid for some (Satyugi) period after 2036?
The original picture of Lakshmi-Narayan (containing the pictures of Trimurti, L-N and Radha-Krishna) depicts the events of Confluence Age as well as the events of the first birth of Golden Age and hence I think it is valid post-2036 also.
new knowledge wrote:how does the Sangamyugi Lakshmi & Narayan & the Satyugi Radha-Krishna appear at the same point of time in the same Picture of Lakshmi & Narayan?
If you can spare time to go through the advanced course related to the picture of L-N, you would know that the L-N depicted in the picture represent the Confluence-Aged L-N, whereas Radha and Krishna depicted in the picture represent the Golden Aged R&K. They are not at the same point of time.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by shivsena » 07 Nov 2008

arjun wrote: The fundamental teachings of advanced knowledge are not contradictory to what Sakar Murlis say. Just as you interpret Ram and ShivBaba to be one personality, just as you interpret Maya to mean the soul of Krishna (which is nowhere mentioned directly in the Sakar Murlis) the advanced knowledge is an advanced interpretation of Sakar Murli.
So it means that advance knowledge is also not the truth spoken by ShivBaba, but it could be the interpretation of Brahma(manushya mat), which could also be proved wrong in the end(like all other interpretations) when Ramshivbaba narrates sacchi Gita.

shivsena.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by andrey » 07 Nov 2008

Dear brother shivsena,

Whether the advanced knowledge is a matter of churning of some human being or is knowledge delivered by the Supreme Soul, no one can really tell. You say it is false and true Gita will be spoken in future, but untill it happens we can never be 100 percent sure it will happen. Prophecy or supositions are not path of knowlege.

Whether advanced knowledge is true or false It is left to the individual discernment, a common oppinion cannot be imposed. For some it could be a lie and cause degradation. If they consider it a lie how could this possibly bring salvation to them. For some it could be true and can cause salvation.

Meanwhile if it is true of false, for the moment we don't have better interpretation of the knowlegde from the Murlis. This is also personal. For me the interpratations that Baba via Virendra Dev Dixit gives are better than yours. In fact there is no essence in what you tell, no interpretation, rather defamation. Look at the post, this could be like this, that could be like that. It could also not be like this and like that. OK leave the advance knowledge be false and PBKs under illusion. You do your own benefit and don't worry about us. Why do you have to insist on your idea if you see that we don't like to listen to it.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by shivsena » 04 Dec 2008

Dear arjun Bhai.

Just read a Murli point which says "Krishna is dehdhari; Krishna ko bap-teacher-Satguru nahin kahenge"; [ who are the souls to whom Shiva is speaking and giving them hints about Krishna. Is it to the outside world or the BKs or the PBKs ?????????? The BKs would apply it to the outside world and PBKs would apply it to the bk world, but the reality is, it speaks about the pbk world.]

The above point clearly indicates that Shiva saw Krishna as dehdhari(through body of Virendra Dev Dixit) after he left his body in 1969, and He also saw that Krishna will play the role of dehdhari dharm guru to mislead the PBKs, which will be seen by PBKs as the role of Bap-teacher-Satguru being played by ShivBaba; only those souls who read and churn the Murlis deeply will understand what Shiva is trying to hint by the above Murli point and to whom it is directed.

shivsena.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by andrey » 04 Dec 2008

Dear brother,

It is said we should see Shiv in the Shav. You are seeing the soul of Krishna that is not according to the Murli.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by shivsena » 06 Dec 2008

Dear arjun Bhai.

Just read a Murli(22-11-99) which says "Kahan Krishna-bhagwanuvach aur kahan shiv-bhagwanuvach; Dono mein raat-din ka farak hai." ; meaning that "there is day and night difference between Krishna-bhagwanuvach(what Krishna says) and shiv-bhagwanuvach"(what Shiva says).

The above Murli point clearly describes the difference between what Krishna(alias brahma) says during brahma ki raat and what Ramshivbaba will say in future; Krishna-bhagwanuvach makes brahma ki raat during the shooting period and shiv-bhagwanuvach converts this raat into din in future. Whenever Krishna-bhagwanuvach is mentioned, then BKs and PBKs think only about the Gita of broad drama, but Shiva is speaking only of the behad ka drama and not what has happened for last 2500 years of broad drama.

shivsena.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by cal » 06 Dec 2008

shivsena wrote:Whenever Krishna-bhagwanuvach is spoken, then BKs and PBKs think only about the the Gita of broad drama,
shivsena.
I concur
Cal

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by andrey » 06 Dec 2008

For the PBKs Krishna Bhagavan uvaach may also mean that the role that is played through the soul of Krishna is not that of the Godfather.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by shivsena » 28 Dec 2008

Dear arjun Bhai.

Murli 15-1-2000 says, "Shiv-bhagwanuvach apne saligramo prati, dono hai nirakar,....shiv-bhagwanuvach kiske prati? ruhani bacchon prati." [ meaning: " God Shiva speaks only to his ruhani children saligram souls, both in nirakari stage"]
Murli 22-11-99, says "Kahan Krishna-bhagwanuvach aur kahan Shiv-bhagwanuvach; Dono mein raat-din ka farak hai." ; meaning that "there is day and night difference between Krishna-bhagwanuvach(what Krishna says) and Shiv-bhagwanuvach"(what Shiva says).

Both Murli points clearly mean that God Shiva (personified form) will speak only to his ruhani children saligram souls(108) in future and not to body-conscious human beings. It also means that uptill now no pbk has become saligram(soul-conscious) and so all the clarifications given by advance knowledge is Krishna-bhagwanuvach only, which is being heard only by manushya (PBKs) and hence going in girti-kalaa. Those who hear shiv-bhagwanuvach in future will have chadti-kalaa in one second.

shivsena.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by new knowledge » 28 Dec 2008

I think, according to the Advance Knowledge, Rudra souls will achieve male personality, then what does the feminine word 'Rudrani' indicate?

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by andrey » 28 Dec 2008

Dear brother shivsena,

In the Murli it is said that one day everyone will listen to the Murli on the TV, it will be played on the radio, written in the newspapers etc. It is said that this knowledge is for everyone, for the whole world, for every soul, for the people of all religions. As time moves the knowledge spreads and the people who hear it become more and not less. Why do you limit the words of God to some selected souls when he does not limit them himself? In the Murli it is said that I teach everyone equally and children imbibe numberwise. Is it said in any Murli that I will sit and teach some souls separately? It is said that children who churn catch deep meanings. So is it a matter of the stage that the soul is whilst listening or is it a matter of the stage of the soul who speaks. Even these Murlis that we have now, who has spoken them Shiv or Krishna? Although nobody has achieved salvation through them we still believe it is the soul of Shiv who has spoken them. Even these Murlis may be told to many, but not everyone listens. Through the same Murli one becomes king and other subject.

At the time of Brahma Baba also and now also when we read the Murli – one soul understands something another something else based on their stage. You try to equalize the stage of the Father with that of the children but is there such thing? It is said that the Father is always in soulconcious stage and does not have troubles with this. So where is the restriction for him to speak spiritually at any time for those who like to listen? You only have put some restriction so we will see if you are right or wrong. Can we predict the future and argue on points which have not happened that how will they happen? You have anyway chosen a well balanced view, because the BKs PBKs believe that soulconcious stage will be achieved in the end etc. they anticipate these end times with feeling for miracle to happen etc like the way you present the matters. So for this also there is agreement with the Bk and PBK line and there is nothing new and revolutionary in your view, nomatter the way you like to present it.

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by arjun » 29 Dec 2008

new knowledge wrote:what does the feminine word 'Rudrani' indicate?
I think it refers to the soul of Jagdamba (as known to the PBKs).

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Re: Swarg ke rachieta

Post by new knowledge » 29 Dec 2008

Does PBKs believe that Rudra souls will get masculine personality? If yes, then obviously Rudrani must not be a Rudra bead as the word 'Rudrani' is a feminine word. Advance Knowledge lebels RudraMala & VijayMala souls respectively as male & female; is this not the subtle shooting of gender-inequality ??

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