Avakyt Dadiji - Dadi Prakashmani's Death

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fluffy bunny
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Re: Standing against the tide, falling on the side of reason

Post by fluffy bunny » 22 Aug 2007

mr green wrote:I think the practise of offering Bhog and sending good wishes to departed souls is lifted straight from Hinduism, as is most BK dharna.

As is calling the spirit of the deceased back into a medium. Not universal but still practised.

I also think, historically, the "sending positive thoughts" has seeped in from the Westerner New Agey elements of the BK family and is not "traditional" or Murli based. It has been avidly adopted by the SS as it looks good and keep the congregation happy/occupied/feeling important and as if they have done something. I will stand corrected if I am wrong. I have distinct remembrances of the faux sincerity and solemn profundity around such occasions. People snivelling that really ought not to be ... and no extra halva.

Meanwhile 40% of the world's poor live on in India. The children keep starving and dying of simple diseases that plumbing, sanitation and hygiene would avoid ...

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chandramani

Post by alladin » 22 Aug 2007

We all know and heard rumours, and sometimes witnessed directly over the years; territory partitions, power games, roles, importance, fame, respect, space given to different SS. According to which criteria?

It's on the Forum that I read, and was amazed, at how Dadi Kumarka elbowed her way to the top after BB's death, pushing aside someone else. So, I would not be surprised about anything that happened or will happen.

One thing for sure, without getting too much into what goes on in India and we are not aware of, as far as we Double Foreigner are concerned, during Madhuban season there have always been very few classes given by SS other than DJ, who lectures every day. So, whatever those Yoginis had to share with us, maybe a lot more than we can imagine, will go in the grave with them. And it's a shame.

Like in politics, some people are given a prestigious symbolic position, but who actually counts and makes decisions? Do we really know? Do we have any right to enjoy transparency?

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Re: chandramani

Post by joel » 23 Aug 2007

alladin wrote:We all know and heard rumours, and sometimes witnessed directly over the years; territory partitions, power games, roles, importance, fame, respect, space given to different SS. According to which criteria? It's on the Forum that I read, and was amazed, at how Dadi Kumarka elbowed her way to the top after BB's death, pushing aside someone else. So, I would not be surprised about anything that happened or will happen.
I had been told the ... ah ... spook appointed Dadi K and Didi Manmohohini after BB died. Two selfless administrators who never disagreed about anything.

Do you have a link to that discussion?
One thing for sure, without getting too much into what goes on in India and we are not aware of, as far as we Double Foreigner are concerned, during Madhuban season there have always been very few classes given by SS other than DJ, who lectures every day. So, whatever those Yoginis had to share with us, maybe a lot more than we can imagine, will go in the grave with them. And it's a shame.
In Madhuban you can talk to many of them personally if you are drawn to.
Like in politics, some people are given a prestigious symbolic position, but who actually counts and makes decisions? Do we really know? Do we have any right to enjoy transparency?
I think the answer is no, or waffle, depending on who you are.

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Post by yudhishtira » 23 Aug 2007

Yes ex-l, you are a great example of the love compassion mercy and wisdom you demand from the BKWSU
What did she really do in her life?
  • Loved unconditionally
    Had faith in souls even when they screwed up
    Always had pure wishes and feelings for everyone
    ie all the things that DJ and JB have chosen not to do.
I'd be happy with that as my epitaph; unfortunatly, I know I cant at the moment.

Thanks to those who've put their bitterness aside. As for those going to be there; yes, there is body-consciousness but there is also love and respect for someone who gave always such a lot their whole life.

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Post by john » 23 Aug 2007

yudhishtira wrote:Had faith in souls even when they screwed up
Always had pure wishes and feelings for everyone
ie all the things that DJ and JB have chosen not to do.[/list]I'd be happy with that as my epitaph; unfortunatly, I know I cant at the moment.
Yudhishtira, how much time did/do you spend with Dadis?
I had been told the ... ah ... spook appointed Dadi K and Didi Manmohohini after BB died. Two selfless administrators who never disagreed about anything.
Dadi K was appointed assistant to another Dadi or Didi.

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Post by fluffy bunny » 23 Aug 2007

John asks a fair question. It might be like judging your parents by what you saw on Christmas day alone.
yudhishtira wrote:Yes ex-l, you are a great example of the love compassion mercy and wisdom you demand from the BKWSU
Funnily enough, I have never asked for any of the first 3 and I take the last to come with the courage to think the unthinkable and ask the questionable. (Especially if the stuff about the 16th January 1969 World Renewal Trust creation turns out to be true ... well, we know the date is truth but I mean the cause of Lekhraj Kirpalani's death).

I am sorry, but its probably a reaction against the slippery slide towards the touchie-feelie and away from the rational and accurate.

I expected more courage to be truthful from yogi souls. She went along with it all, riding on a golden throne held high. I'll wait and see the product of all her efforts and guidance ...

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Post by bkti-pit » 23 Aug 2007

ex-l wrote:What did she really do in her life?
yudhishtira wrote:Loved unconditionally
Had faith in souls even when they screwed up
Always had pure wishes and feelings for everyone
I also experienced that from her. I always felt that she had the same love, care, presence and attention for all, whatever the social status, wealth, skin color, etc. In that respect she has been an inspiration. I would not say that she had no flaw but she definitely won my heart and my unconditional respect.

We have been instructed to have Yoga bhattis for her since last October or so but I always thought that we needed the Yoga bhattis, not her. She has won our blessings, love and good feelings anyway and she has won God's heart too. What else does she need? I don't think that our worries or our so called Yoga would help in any way.

Baba many times told us to show the return of love by becoming equal. The purpose of these Yoga bhattis for me have been to look at her as an example and imbibe her specialities in my life in a practical way.

It will be interesting to hear what BapDada will have to say and to watch the games of politics and power grabbing that will go on whatever he says.

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Post by fluffy bunny » 23 Aug 2007

BKTi-Pit wrote:We have been instructed to have Yoga bhattis for her since last October or so but I always thought that we needed the Yoga bhattis, not her.
You see, this is a typical example Yude ...

What is really going on? One could argue ANY excuse to encourage BKs to have more meditation is worthy but that is all it is. Alternatively, is it not just an elite impressing themselves on our mind (to be followed up by a "state funeral", celebratory day of rememberance, hagiographies)?

On one hand they say, "don't remember anyone ... eat halva" etc. Then on the other they weep tears and say; remember us, have Yoga for us, sanctify us. "We are the highest on high." What is being celebrated? Being right or conforming to the image.
  • 83 or 84 births?

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Post by mr green » 23 Aug 2007

I must say the two BKs response here does demonstrate aspects of adulation ... I mean how well did you really know her, I wonder?

You say she always had love for all, mmmmmmm I saw her harsh side many times. Just depends how close you got to her, hehe.

I am not disrespecting her, I have equal respect for all human beings. But she is not on a pedastool from where I am standing.

Yude, when you use the term bitterness. You do realise you yourself are using the term in a derogatory way. One could even say with bitterness ... just a thought.

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Post by bkti-pit » 23 Aug 2007

mr green wrote:I must say the two BKs response here does demonstrate aspects of adulation ... I mean how well did you really know her, I wonder?
I did say that I did not think she was flawless.

We have a young sister here, young body and young BK. Very sweet, always smiling. I never saw her bitter. Even when older sisters blow up on her, I always saw her keeping her self respect and responding with dignity. I find it very inspiring and she has won my respect too, although I know she has flaws.

I cannot say the same for all our so called Seniors!

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Post by mr green » 23 Aug 2007

BKTi-Pit wrote:I did say that I did not think she was flawless. We have a young Sister here, young body and young BK. Very sweet, always smiling. I never saw her bitter. Even when older Sisters blow up on her, I always saw her keeping her self respect and responding with dignity. I find it very inspiring and she has won my respect too, although I know she has flaws. I cannot say the same for all our so called Seniors!
Yes, I agree with you,

I tell you something else too, I used to dislike the bk notion that everyone outside the Yagya is experiencing sorrow!!! Many BKs still believe this, that everyone is like a mosquito in an Ocean of Poison!!!!!!

It just is not true, I have found many better balanced and happy individuals outside the Yagya, and what's more many people who are just a lot nicer!!!!!!

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Post by bansy » 23 Aug 2007

ex-l wrote:Meanwhile 40% of the world's poor live on in India. The children keep starving and dying of simple diseases that plumbing, sanitation and hygiene would avoid ...
In Madhbhan, I have heard Seniors talk about such situation. Most often the reply was "Let's hope Destruction comes soon, so to ease the pain and suffering". Shock.
how well did you really know her
We can only give an impression of someone by only our contacts with them, whether one day or one decade. After all someone who is a mass murderer but befriends you whilst in jail you will only have good wishes for, but not necessarily so before jail.

In my case, I have met Dadi K a few times, and its been both good and bad, so no indifference. May be it is because I feel she has little contact with double foreigners in general and does not give classes, whereas even Dadi Gulzar does and also travels the world. Dadi K is an Indian soil BK although in her early years she did much travel. How many of you would have liked to have met Dadi K in your home country centre, regardless of Dadi worship or not?

I wonder what discussion she could now have with Veerendra Dev Dixit ? Maybe time to pop over for a cup of tea.

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Post by john » 23 Aug 2007

bansy wrote:I wonder what discussion she could now have with Veerendra Dev Dixit ? Maybe time to pop over for a cup of tea.
Yes, I believe she was the one who banned Virendra Dev Dixit from going to any BK centre and had him physically removed.
How many of you would have liked to have met Dadi K in your home country centre, regardless of Dadi worship or not ?
Yes, I would have. My only personal experience was very good, to me she came across as warm, friendly and radiating lots of power.

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Post by bkti-pit » 23 Aug 2007

mr green wrote:I used to dislike the BK notion that everyone outside the Yagya is experiencing sorrow!!! I have found many better balanced and happy individuals outside the Yagya, and what's more many people who are just a lot nicer!!!!!!

There are probably some souls who recently came from Paramdham and are still in their Golden Age but I don't know any. I see sorrow everywhere. I don't mean "nothing but sorrow" but I don't know anyone who doesn't experience some sorrow, and BKs are no less. I see a lot of suppressed sorrow in the BKs, not only sorrow from the past 63 births but also sorrow from the BK interactions. And there is a lot of denial about it. Not healthy!

There are indeed a lot of very nice people outside the BKs and it throws me off when BKs are bloating with their sense of superiority and preach the world whilst the reality is that many cannot even simply be nice to one another. Let alone being angels and world benefactors!

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Post by yudhishtira » 24 Aug 2007

Not adulation Mr Green. Love and respect. Believe it or not; if you were in the same situation and souls were making similar remarks about you, I would ask for the same love and respect to be shown.

I have not spent a lot of time with Dadis; and I am only talking about 1 anyway. However, I am close contact with souls who have had closer connection with her and yet who are like me, now not in the mainstream. I suppose my views are coloured by that.

You say I am bitter? Yes, probably. I guess my levels of tolerence for this level of lack of humanity are as low with you guys as they are with the BKs. When I've become perfect, I'll let you know.

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