Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

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fluffy bunny
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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by fluffy bunny » 15 Mar 2008

I think you make a valid point, sparkal. I mean, why to they put feelers out for "professionals" instead of just "simple folk with commonsense and integrity"?

I think there is some salt in your argument. For professionals read; individuals with an ability to put up a front, complicate matters, sustain that and contrive to outsiders convincingly ... let's see what they come up with though. Actions speak louder.

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by paulkershaw » 17 Mar 2008

A question I'll also ask here is that when 'professionals' are chosen, who does the choosing and what are the criteria?

By the look of the names already lsted on the document, it may be that each person on the committee 'to be formed' may have an inherent interest in self and their current income - in other words they may have a particular self-interest agenda which needs to be maintained within the committee, so they end up not representing a 'professional approach' at all.

A bit like Robert Mugabe's 'government' perhaps?

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by primal.logic » 17 Mar 2008

They will be refering to professionals in the mental health care area - there are BKs who are psychologists and psychiatrists - Sarah Egger being one. That someone can study psychiatry and still be a cult member is quite extraordinary in my books. It demonstrates the power of belief and how natural it is for belief to bend reality to fit. It is like a Christian geologist who believes in creationism and that the world was made in 7 days - and there are those who do - if you have ever been to a reference library and seen who writes the books supporting Creationism it is quite a shock. How can such well informed people be such profound victims of their own beliefs!!! And now we are relying on BK 'psychologists' and 'professionals' to solve these problems??!

Forget it.

The Brahma Kumaris entire intelligentsia is focussed only on increasing membership.

They are entirely clueless in all other regards - except at cooking the books. But then, it is no secret that an Indian + Money = Cheat. If you think that sounds severe then you haven't been witness to 1) The BK accounting machine or 2) Indians doing business (cheating is accepted as a normal part of business. That is how Jayanti's Father went bust - he was cheated out of all his money in a deal with one of his friends).

The BK management have no interest in ex-BKs because there is nothing in it for them.

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by fluffy bunny » 18 Mar 2008

primal.logic wrote:The BK management have no interest in ex-BKs because there is nothing in it for them.
It may well be true. We are not going to pay for a special Bhog offering, we are not going to promise our 10% of wages and they are not going to get our 'annual subscription' paid to Mount Abu. I wonder if the Seniors really see it in such dry terms?

On the other hand, I wonder if they calculate our negative impact on their business by blowing the whistle on them? May be that is why some Indian Seniors were not concerned about the ex-BK sites and saw them just as a problem for the West. Not enough Indians can connect to the internet ... not enough impact on their business interests?

I heard Jayanti was giving BKs a lecture in Abu about making sure they give their money to Baba first. Apparently too many BKs were taking money to India ... only to spend it in the shops instead. I suppose even in the BK owned shops that means the WSU has to give back some capital return.

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by sparkal » 18 Mar 2008

If a professional is someone who practises what they do, then all teachers of Raja Yoga are professionals.

It doesn't sound correct to call a Raja Yoga teacher a professional does it?

The term professional usually refers to the making of money. So which is it BKs? Are Raja Yoga teachers professionals even if they don't make money? Confused?

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by paulkershaw » 19 Mar 2008

The term 'professional' is usually applied to someone who has studied and attained a degree or recognised dipoma in some modality or the other. It is common to associate a professional career with a Doctor or Lawyer for example. This approach is causing major upset in many fields of learning around the world especially in the healthcare industry. For example I have studied massage therapy for many years but cannot (at present) get recognised as a professional therapist or even use the term 'therapist' as my line of study is not recognised by certain supposedly professional health care councils, all made up by board members more interested in looking after their own finances than anything else. This, in my opinion, is not professional behaviour and I am aware of it happening in many other countries too.

My point of wrtiting this is to say that a 'professional' may only have their own specific agenda at heart. To look after number 1.

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts- Bull ****

Post by yogi108 » 19 Mar 2008

Hello Everyone,

This whole initiative looks to me as to holding on to the dying BK folks who might have read so much from this site and ran to the center and talked to the Sister-in-charge ... I once met one of the senior bro's in an airport and he was talking about the brother's death (read as hanged-to-death) as a media hype more than anything else ... For me, it was surprising that a senior brother like him had to defend the organisation so much and call it media hype ... the bro's name is Brij Mohan ...

Believe me, if at all anything would work for the Yagya today is a complete cleansing of the whole damn sister stuff and bringing in people who really know how to run an organisation ...

Like how they have rules to go to Madhuban, they should also have a information handbook as to how they are structured, how does the money you donate get utilised ... how important is your family, career and your children etc ... while maintaining their strict code or Maryadas as to speak ...

I would really like to give them a piece of my mind ... In fact, I am planning to write a small note to Sister Jayanti as to what I feel about the whole thing ... I am sure it will get ignored ... but, hey, it wouldn't cost me anything to do that ...

Yogi

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by fluffy bunny » 19 Mar 2008

What paul says is correct. The words, "the Professions" refer to a handful of vocations that generally carry a serious burden of responsibility towards the general public, for example: Doctors/Surgeons, Lawyers, Engineers, Teachers, Diplomats, Professors, Priests, Architects, Accountants etc

"Professional activity" involves systematic knowledge and proficiency, are usually regulated by professional bodies that may set examinations of competence, act as a licensing authority for practitioners and enforce adherence to an ethical code of practice.

In my opinion, the teachers and center-in-charges of the BKWSU SHOULD be made to adhere to professional standards in terms of the system's transparency and accountability, and that they are dabbling with the human mind at a level deeper than most psychotherapists. But I think they absolutely need to call in expertise from outside of the organization ... and not from one of their sycophantic part-time followers either ... just as the Hare Krishnas did. Of course, that would be a huge challenge to the leaderships' God given ego. And they would have to pay for such services. I doubt they would accept such recommendations.

Paul is also correct about the degree of monopolistic rights some professions exercise and this is unfortunate. With human beings come politics ... but whether we are inside or outside of a professional body, we can still learn and apply professional processes. The alternative in some situations is just to start one's own body. Many of the professions have completing professional bodies.

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by primal.logic » 20 Mar 2008

I am planning to write a small note to Sister Jayanti as to what I feel about the whole thing ... I am sure it will get ignored ... but, hey, it wouldn't cost me anything to do that ...
Absolutely! As BK management do not solicit feedback they simply don't get any - with the net effect that they live in a world of delirium. Feedback is essential as a reality check. But you are right yogi108, a small note will be ignored. A big note will not! From past experience as a 'senior' bk, shouting is all they hear above the noise of their own egos. What has proven an effective noise maker is the good old fashioned petition.

I would recommend an objective and constructive 'note' that you can show to others (people who can think and are not afraid of their own spiritual weaknesses) and get their consent/agreement/signature. The further you circulate it the better. Believe me - Jayanti will be contacting you!

The BKWSU desperately needs people within its ranks who can see the consequences of secretive, totalitarian management. The rest of the world worked it out - rampant ideologists with values driven messages were the norm back in the 60's and 70's and look what happened.

A handbook is also a very good idea. Something that could be given to any new bk that will help them survive random despotic Centre-in-Charges who are abusing their 'power'.

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by fluffy bunny » 20 Mar 2008

primal.logic wrote:A handbook is also a very good idea. Something that could be given to any new BK that will help them survive random despotic Centre-in-Charges who are abusing their 'power'.
Especially if it was done independently and without seeking "permission" or acknowledgement of the Seniors. No need really, its all between yourselves and god with no middlewomen necessary.

Looking at it the other way, its your karma too if you do not pre-warn and pre-arm new BKs! We started a thread on that somewhere else in the Forum.

NOTE: no response from any current or official BKs on this topic yet. I would how many rank and file BKs are involved in this reform process ... or are they just going to be serve a finished product like at McDonalds. "Instant Ethics: 1 Million served to date!"

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by yogi108 » 21 Mar 2008

All are interesting suggestions ...

It will be nice to initiate a handbook for the BKs, by someone in this forum, with suggestions and inputs from different folks with varied experiences ... This could even be written as a commercially available book ... sold on, e.g. ... Amazon ...

We could even target the different followers of other paths where in I am sure that these practices are surely existing ... It could be centered around the New Age spiritual organisations with BKs in particular but then keeping in mind other spiritual organizations as well in mind ...

I know of similar cases in Mata Amritayanandi, or something like that, where in someone I knew who was a finance professional wound up his New York home and went to Kerala to dedicate his life towards the organisation, only to return after 4 years filled with regret ...

Selling the book might be a big effort but a free pdf download for the benefit of many practising BKs would be a good idea to start with.

Yogi

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by mr green » 26 Mar 2008

In my opinion the first mistake here is it is still the same old names, they need fresh blood and new ideas, not these same old dinosaurs (what are they!) ... time for democratic consensus from all BKs who want to contribute to what the BKWSU means to them ... not just to the self-elected.

These are the very people that have the created a climate of fear and senior worship within the BKs and people like Maureen, and so on, are still practitioners of senior worship ... I've said directly to Jayanti before that she has helped create a climate of fear and she just looked hurt, without understanding.

It's good they are waking up to the problems, but I am not sure they are the ones to solve it ... you see this is still at the end of a day a directive memo passed on down through the hierarchy ... I don't want to slate it as such, but I feel they need to change the whole system from a fundamental level.

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fossils

Post by alladin » 26 Mar 2008

Hi, Mr. Green, nice to see you!

I don't think that dinosaurs, stuffed animals or fossils feel they need to change. They call that stability.

Maybe what they are interested in, is getting more visible show-cases in the museums, with good wordings translated in several languages, and spotlights. It's all more about closing ranks, hardening and petrifying rather than moulding in this organization. Re-painting the façade at the most! They are perfect, they hold the truth and adjusting, tolerating, bowing, yielding, admitting and correcting one's own mistakes and other virtuous qualities are for common people to be practised, not for the high caste priests or pharaohs!

Status is status and stiffness and unchangeability is intrinsic to it. 8)

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Re: Official BKWSU internal reform efforts

Post by fluffy bunny » 27 Mar 2008

I agree that they must be torturing themselves to think how they have be mould themselves into yet another shape. I agree that the outcome is much more likely to be for the sakes of public impression. And I agree that it is difficult to think that the same old faces ... including those that have very much been part of the corruption on various levels ... can come up with something new.

But ... they have never been in a situation like this before where such strong lights are focused on them in public, reaching out to those they seek to use to promote themselves and I encourage members and readers to continue talking to others about what they have read, seen and experienced. Don't be silenced in fear by the accusations of "defamation". Tell the truth and shame the devil.

To be honest, if I was them, I would step back and hand things over to someone or something else, e.g. a properly formulated and accountable organization. It just does not exist within the BKWSU. The BKWSU is a joke, a joke University. It has to be said. Only mental retards, or the insanely dishonest, would so persistently pretend to be something they are not.

Its fine to say, "we would like to be a University" and then go off to work towards it ... but to run something that is a cross between a kindergarten, an old folks home and incestuous medieval court and call it the "Godly University" is the big defamation of all! :biggrin:

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and yet charmed by it!

Post by alladin » 27 Mar 2008

The BKWSU is a joke, a joke University. It has to be said. Only mental retards, or the insanely dishonest, would so persistently pretend to be something they are not. Its fine to say, "we would like to be a University" and then go off to work towards it ... but to run something that is a cross between a kindergarten, an old folks home and incestuous medieval court and call it the "Godly University" is the big defamation of all!
thank you for making me laugh before I shut down the PC! Yes, it's like that song "just an illusion".

I remember some old interesting posts about the "emperor's clothes". So, no need to repeat it in my mail. I think that seeing some grotesque facets or even the essence of the BKWSO doesn't mean becoming "atheists", or despising spirituality.

Questions such as how and why people want to portray and sell themselves, deserves an answer. But even more interesting, would be to find out is why we, and even more intriguing, why and how did I :?: fall prey of the illusion, the spell?? What need was there for me to compromise with rubbish and foggy stuff?? Do I have the honesty and capacity to give myself an answer? Or do I need to pay a shrink to help me solve the riddle?

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