Healing for money

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peterbindi
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Healing for money

Post by peterbindi » 20 Jul 2008

Dear all.

There are people in this world who heal people for money with so called magnetism, tarot, astrology, color or aroma therapy etc etc. This Bhakti I hatred immense ... sorry I must say this :sad: ... to take money from it, for me it is a sign that we live in a hellish world.

I can not feel respect for those people who do this, Its like poison so I feel.

Have any one here also more and a less overcome this situation in their life ... and how to handle this in live (yukti)?

The tools we get from ... nature ... must stay natural and clean so I feel :D .

peterbindi.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by hope1 » 20 Jul 2008

Hang on ... Someone pays money to learn a skill like massage aromatherapy or any other New Age 'healing" thang. They advertise to people who want to believe in it to offer them that skill for money and you are calling that Bhakti? Please..

Sorry, if you are trying to compare that to the situation with Gyan where we are given information free and are therefore morally obliged to offer it free. You are hitting out of the ball park. You've just shot down in flames a good chunk of the Western and Eastern working community!!

By that logic, I could say I cannot have respect for people who are given a logical intellect by nature and expect to be paid by us to apply this to managing our finances or fixing our computers.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by peterbindi » 20 Jul 2008

Dear hope1.

Nature never asked you for money to breath and it is there every moment. These so called healing houses are already or become big business. And to say with respect i think you don't see the point here. What is pure and what is not pure.

I have a lot respect for the farms in the country. There you can go for nothing and they give you help ;) .

peterbindi.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by fluffy bunny » 20 Jul 2008

Sure ... and why don't we have free dentists offering New Age healing dentistry too? Did that BK trustee Goodman offer free dentistry for senior BKs? That would have been a good business perk.

I have no idea how and when money came in to heaven to corrupt Eden but, for sure, its effect is now pretty universal. And, for sure, the god of the BKs is pretty tuned into it. I was shocked to read that BKs were allowed to charge as long as they gave a 20% commission to the Janki Foundation.

But then, surely, by BK logic, that must be a memorial from Bhakti of King Janak?

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by hope1 » 20 Jul 2008

ex-l wrote:But then, surely, by BK logic, that must be a memorial from Bhakti of King Janak?
:-?
yeah, for sure; she's certainly got her kingdom sorted out on this age, never mind any other. And yeah, I think you are right about the dentist guy. Must have the pictures with the good smiles!!

Peter, I think your concept is a little naive.. this is the good 'ol Iron age, when everyone wants to make a buck... even the "incorruptable " BKs... to expect any more of New Age healers in particular is ...weird! We can call into question how effective tarot, colour therapy and the rest are, but the fact is people have a free choice to pay for their services. How would you propose those people fed themselves and their families if they gave their services for free? or would you suggest they be like the BKs and got their clients to give "voluntary" contributions and also take out second mortgages on their houses to support new building projects?
and what free farms do you speak of? In what country?

It would be great to live in a society where we could barter our skills, and didnt have to worry about the IRS or the mortgage, but at the moment many people are struggling just to survive.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by peterbindi » 20 Jul 2008

Dear hope1.

Maybe i am a little old fashion,but to transport energy from 1 soul to the other in thinking, speaking or actions for spiritual benefit and then asking money for this for me is a red flag.

Let say i find 2 apples from a three for free and then i meet some one who is very hunger and need this apple,there is something very wrong if i ask this person money for this apple,this action makes the hole thing selfish is not it and what is the affect of this.

Hope1 this iron age of inner being is clear to me and i feel it is rotten,the bad smell is every were.
My question is how to accept this aspect and go on with the good work :D .
I am sure that in every country that there are people who can heal others,mostly they live in some village... simple people like farmers,for free and the are just a few of them.(respect for them).
I live in Holland and here there is no need to be without money at all special for people with skills.

What i also doubt is this New Age knowledge,they are endless differing each other,some of them are okay and play there role with good blood,but the most of them are rubbish.

peterbindi.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by tom » 21 Jul 2008

peterbindi wrote
to transport energy from 1 soul to the other in thinking, speaking or actions for spiritual benefit
and then asking money for this for me is a red flag.
I agree with you peterbindi, it stinks when through such a gift people make big money. But than according to your logic only the gifted ones with personal income like the farmers in small villages you mentioned should practice spiritual healing or healing with bioenergy or healing with alternative medicine whatever they call. It is a dilemma how should the others in the big cities survive, who have no other jobs and income and devote their whole time to their healing activity ? Put a box for donations?What would the income tax department do to them than?

I myself have taken benefit of spiritual healing twice in my lifetime in the big cities. And i have experienced miraculous results. In one case the healer was a retired person and was doing it for sewa. I was insisting and leaving some money occasionally when i had the possibility, in order not to create karma.My life was saved with his immense efforts and energy and i just wanted to give something small in return and make a contribution to his simple life.

The other healer another time, was an internist, doctor of medicine and had different other diplomas from different universities of the world for alternative healing practices and the price was fixed. We don't go to the doctors and wait from them to look after us for free, don't we? They also have a body to look after and mostly a whole family.
Let say i find 2 apples from a three for free and then i meet some one who is very hunger and need this apple,there is something very wrong if i ask this person money for this apple,this action makes the hole thing selfish isn,t it and what is the affect of this.
You are right, it is Kaliyuga which makes everything rotten. Only allow me to make some remarks on your apples.I know, in this age the apples are not growing from themselves. The apple tree belongs to some farmer. And maybe the farmer's life depends on these apples.Maybe he has invested his whole time and money to grow them. I may get some apples with his permission or without -than it is called stealing, is not it? But these are considered small crimes we do them without thinking much of the consequences. And then if i meet somebody who wants them, a) i can give them as i got them for free, b) or if the person gives me some money in return, this money belongs to the farmer, not to me.

How i pay it back is up to my conscience. I can visit the farmer one day and give him the money,or if it is not possible i can donate the money on behalf of the farmer to somebody in need.

Yes, peterbindi, good old days ,where people were living simple lives in simple houses surrounded with gardens full of fruit trees are gone. In the country we can still find generous people who give their apples and their healing energy for free but i think we have to consider that they also have their needs to survive.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by peterbindi » 21 Jul 2008

Dear tom.

Also these apples can be seen as spiritual.. you can find in your mind ..after live experience and then help other people with it,like energy or yukti or talking etc. This inner healing world, discover in live that,s what make,s you pretty your face isn,t it :D .

And it look very stupid that all the helpful people here on the forum will ask money for there precious information they give. This is also what they do to people, telephone or e mail consults money makers.

peterbindi.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by paulkershaw » 21 Jul 2008

Paying for the services of a healer is correct and appropriate. For instance a friend of mine is a medium who channels an ascended master being and has dedicated her entire life to doing so and does nothing else and is entirely dependant on the income she makes from it. She is not a charlatan, she does not fake what she does, and she goes through extremely difficult processes in life, just the same as each one of us do. Her heart is centred around the spiritual work that she holds so dear and has 'surrendered' completely to it. How else is she supposed to make a living? A mastered life is not about begging and doing without and I'd say that through her work, she probably makes less income than if she worked in a 'professional' position.

I'd also comment here is that people value for what they pay for - but also people should be happy to pay for what they receive without being ripped off and unfortunately the spiritual world is full of people out to make a quick buck and who prey on the vulnerable. I know plenty of healers that I'd trust my well-being to and I also know plenty who I wouldn't go near.

In the same tone, some medical doctors don't certainly deserve an income; many certainly do. I remember asking in an earlier thread "exactly what is it that constitutes a healer?" I also say that if one feels that its not correct to pay for 'healing' then one does not also understand exactly what 'healing' means either, as one cannot associate a value to it. IMO, a medical doctor, often may not 'heal' their patient (onen to discusssion on this of course....) whilst a true-blue healer will facilitate an inner exchange which creates a state of both inner and external well-being.
An xample of what I am saying here is that I've been to a doctor who never looked up from his pad, just wrote out a script and said "come back next week if you don't feel better?" - and I had to pay for his expert 'time" too. Thanx for caring.

However, the real question here is: " How does one find that true-blue healer?" - which in itself would bring in a myriad of opinions and questions. For example, can a BK rajyogi really 'heal' the world by giving it 'drishti'? and their payment is what" : a place in their supposed 'heaven' ? That's payment is it not?

And also what the difference between someone receiving reiki in a day spa or well-being clinic from a worn out therapist as opposed to someone lovingly and gently performing the same service from a private space in their or the recipients home? Does a certificate on a wall mean that much when the intention is clearly different?

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by tom » 21 Jul 2008

Dear peterbindi
peterbindi wrote
Also these apples can be seen as spiritual.. .
Exactly. I was also using them as metaphors.
And it look very stupid that all the helpful people here on the forum will ask money for there precious information they give.
No, they are not asking and wanting anything from us. But given the fact how much time and energy and money they have to spend to keep going this forum, i believe it would be very good for us if the creators and sustainers of this forum would allow us= forum members to contribute also financially according to our possibilities to this forum.Only think of the expensive procedure BKWSU's legal action against this forum and think of the mostly full time work they need to do for sustenance.This is greatest sacrifice.

I have written more than once to info@brahmakumaris.info asking kindly for an account number to send my humble contribution Paybal but i have not got any answer.Here in this forum i think we members are like small children selfish enjoying ourselves expressing our views on a ready made playground and most members like peterbindi not thinking at the silent effort and sacrifice of time and material of the ones who sustain this playground.Because nobody wants from us anything, nobody asks for anything.

Dear peterbindi, i think we should not take real sacrifices for granted.In fact nothing is granted. At the end, for everything somebody has to pay the bill.

best wishes

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by fluffy bunny » 21 Jul 2008

File me under hippie idealist when it comes to a cashless world ... but, sadly, I have not seen any local economic or barter systems either work or address societies other problems, e.g. even within the sharing caring New Age barter systems single mothers get paid nothing to do cooking or housework while gee-whiz male "fung shui masters" are paid 10 times more of the invented money.

I have done some time in alternative health/healing centers and you also see the flip side of it ... folks that expect their healing for free or can afford to leave a donation even to keep the center running ... but all the same they can still afford to smoke, drink, run a car or go on holiday.

I have no answers but I do not think enlightenment via the Brahma-kumaris is "free". Its just that they or the holy ghosts, like any good marketeers, offer you a loss leader for nothing upfront but once you are hooked start reeling the money and time in.

I am concerned by these tales of commissions being paid back to the Janki Foundation.

Does not the Janki Foundation help fund the Global Hospital which then provides free healthy care and hospice services for the chosen few Brahma Kumaris? So is not that the Brahma Kumaris training individuals up on a "product" on the basis that they get a commission back for it? That is not Shrimat, is it even charity and it makes a mockery of the "we never charge" claim.

But ... they will get away with it in India and it is not the worst thing in the world.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by peterbindi » 21 Jul 2008

Dear all.

The point is after reading these post on this subject..were once in history started money come from in the most pure form. Maybe when when know this it is a lot easyer to understand and how it was supose to be. Was money once pure or is it always impure and corrupt?

And how healing started in the pure form in humanity and Paul to give a gift to a good healer is OK, but to ask money for spiritual skills for me is still a red flag. Tom, I am aware that this forum is stay together not from air :D.

peterbindi.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by paulkershaw » 22 Jul 2008

Goeie More Peter:

I feel that what you are probably saying is that a barter system would be better (as it's written in many historical docs) and that in order to maintain the original intention of the 'energy' then it cannot be charged for?... Should this be limited to healers and the like-minded? I do know that its a 'system' that's already in place amongst several of my friends who share 'therapies' amongst themselves.
A case of "I do something for you, and you do something for me," a sharing and caring system?

I think that still prevalent in some traditional parts of the world and probably works in that sense of the word but can only work when other systems (such as money) are not involved. It's probably something that the world is going to have to go back to at any rate, given the scientific and financial projections about the crash of major currencies and the lack of black gold (oil) in the nearby future. So metal Gold and Bartering it seems, will be the new currencies over the next few years.

I'd hazard an opinion to say that anything thats built on 'false' premises and beliefs would have to go too. Of course, we would have to understand exactly what 'false belief's' are too.

To share a memory: I remember an occassion where a new BKWSU 'student' was taught the 7 day course and the student was so grateful that he brought a gift to the centre (a 'repayment was needed' in his awareness perhaps?) and left it in the centre's kitchen sink without anyone seeing him do so....

The Gift :"a big smelly raw fish!" Now, thats so ironic and really good memory for me. :D and the laugh I get about it nowadays is very Healing, better than money for sure.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by peterbindi » 22 Jul 2008

Dear Paul.

The fact that i really do not know were money is coming from makes it difficult to understand this aspect of healing. But the fact that nobody is ever settled up from nature to pay practical money for inner skills is also a fact. BTW, how do you want to pay nature in cash?
I think healing and to help other people come,s from the heart and this must stay clean as posible also in the iron age,and this is not easy at all I know. So I think first earn your bread so that you can live and than use your skills for healing for free and never asking money for this precious act, so I feel.

Yes, this barter system were in the world and still is, and it is a step in the good direction. Paul, deep in me I feel very strict that it is not permitted to ask for healing because than the result is the best :D. To hold your head above this iron age ocean of poisonous money and be a free blue pure blood healer is very rare, and the most people don't have the courage and power to do this.

So perhaps the money in this is a step of degree.

peterbindi.

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Re: Healing for money.

Post by paulkershaw » 22 Jul 2008

Its a good 'ideal' I s'pose Peter. But I would also ask this:

Suppose we know someone who is a fantastic proven "healer" and also believes that he/she should not ask for money for their skill/gift. Suppose then that this person has to work a full time job in order to support themselves financially and does their healing on a part-time no charge basis but only works because he/she has to and therefore cannot have many clients due to the time he/she has available.

Would it not be more fair for everyone for that healer to give up their full-time job and focus on their healing so that many more people could benefit ? - but obviously he/she would then have to charge for their services as they've given up thier daytime work in order to heal more people? It' a Catch 22 situation ...

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