A neutral forum for congenial discussions and reservations related to the Godly Knowledge between ALL parties.
- fluffy bunny
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- Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: ex-BK. Interested in historical revisionism, failed predictions and abuse within the BK movement.
How do we know?Andrey wrote:Men in power today ... what do they have ... for example they have control over petrol and because we're very dependent on using petrol for moving, they have power, or electricity etc. So when God comes he lays His hand over the most important natural richness the sexual power in man and woman. He takes this into His control. He teaches purity. Is this not clever? However He does not do it for his own benefit but for our benefit. Is this not strange?
- • May be by stopping us swop sexual and emotional energy between ourselves, Shiva soul can suck it all up and use it to sustain himself, making himself powerful and us weak?
• May be it was just Lekhraj Kirpalani that started to teach purity as a response to all the critics of 'Om Mandali' that accused him of wife stealing and mesmerizing a harem of willing young women? Om Mandali was a fantastic-psychic-hippie-cult exerience. I wish I remembered my past life there ...
•It is a cultural issue and at the same time a challenge against existing male order.
•May be he is just separating souls from their soul mates to stop human perfection coming along that way?
•May be he is just a jealous God who wants all the attention?
If you don't want opening discussion, better to ask such questions in the PBK forum.
Personally, I think it is just a yukti. It is not the be all and end all BKs or liberals make it out to be. And that there is some truth in the first three options above.
a soul cannot be seen, but understood. do you understand what a soul is?
If not ... let's try again just try to understand what a soul is. We cannot know if it is like this or not. In this knowledge only the mind and intellect works, becausue the one who teaches is only a soul. You cannot use anything gross to study. You cannot see or touch or taste. So forget about these. A soul is very tiny. Can you imagine? This soul contains mind, intellect, sanskaras; its a wonder....
OK, the same way a soul comes and teaches through the mouth. He says be pure. Will you not obey Me?
We know that if this knowledge comes from God, there will be benefit from it. (Shiva means benefactor). Purity is the mother to peace and happiness.
The hippy - point cannot be because these girls have come exactly because purity used to be taught, not the other way round.
The sexual energy cannot be stopped. We can transform it and use it for our own good. He teaches this. This energy is scattered every time we have a dirty desire towards someones's body. A little bit of this energy goes away in that direction. He controls even the thoughts, because thoughts go to different directions out of desire for benefit. But these are temporary happinesses which causes our energy to flow and our sorrow to come. He teaches to concentrate this energy and achive constant happiness by going above desire and having desire for happiness that the soul can experience through self realisation rather than sensual enjoyment.
Yes, he likes all our attention.
Perfection is equal to soul conciousness.
How does he control our energy, our thoughts? He does not at all do all of these. He only has knowledge to give. We use it. We start to control our thoughts and our energy. But why are we attracted to him? Because he is very - ever pure. What is pure attracts (like kumaris). But he is like ... constantly concentrated - like a black hole - so we are attracted to that power. Purity means nothing can be put over him, nothing can influence him - purity that if you put something on a pure smooth surface it slips away ... this way Sita, although she was in the jail of Ravan, remained pure - uninfluenced. We aim to become uninfluenced and this can be achieved only with the power of the intellect going above. The intellect being uninfluenced, not attracted towards whatever comes through the senses. That's why Baba uses the example that if a mother is bound (has a husband) ... no one can bind her intellect. If the intellect goes away from the body, the body is like dead and there is no attraction towards dead body (yes, i know the cases where there is ... I mean generally). That's why also kumaris are protected by their mother and Father because purity means not being infuenced. Whatever the eyes see they remember etc. ... so, if we are to be faithful to one, everything else will be impurity.
And how it is that he has the most influence, because he is always present, not omnipresent, but always present. If he is here, he is always here, he does not go here or there with his attention with his power of concentration. That's why he is the best husband of all, because he is very strict, he does not go to sleep or leave somewhere to business trip so that the wife can be with someone else. He desires the whole attention. And through this one company the soul can become pure. Through the company of more than one, the soul becomes impure. That's why the beginninig of the Copper Age is called the beginning of impurity; because there are two different influences. Two religions, two directions.
Religion in general and many of spiritual faith make such a big deal out of sexuality, but I am yet to see any real evidence that anyone has conquered/transformed it ... the practice of celibacy is not a new thing, just ask the catholics.
there again there are many faiths and spiritual groups who embrace sexual energy and try to capture that energy for their own gains. In eastern countries the penis is seen as a force of great healing and also warding off bad spirits. I can regularly be found warding off bad spirits with mine :lol:
Yes, so far it's all talk.religion in general and many of spiritual faith make such a big deal out of sexuality, but I am yet to see any real evidence that anyone has conquered/transformed it ...
:lol:in eastern countries the penis is seen as a force of great healing and also warding off bad spirits. I can regularly be found warding off bad spirits with mine
Is it good to avoid answers in order to protect a false feeling of safety of ones own beliefs. We will be really safe only when we have conquered lust.
What is not possible through practice? The subject of purity is even before Yoga “Be holy, be yogi” Both complement one another. This subject makes one worthy of worship. Here effort lies.
What will be the evidence of conquering and transforming lust? One would have become master over the self, and lust would have become a slave. Now when there is influence to the sex organ the mind becomes crazy. That’s why we practice concentration and control over the mind, then along with this organ, eyes /which are so difficult to control/ and all other organs of the body come under control. Practical proof will be that even in the company of others, with whichever bodily organ it may be, one’s own mind will not be influenced and will be stabe and under control, organs will be under control, ones own energy will not go down. I don’t know how this can be seen from outside. I believe anyone can say for himself or shivsena Bhai can say, because he is an expert in noting the percentage of the stage.
I know monks practice purity, but why do I don’t like to become a monk. How it is that I have never taught I will like to lead a pure life but I do. It is because all the religions (spiritual paths) pass through stages and reach degradation. Only one soul does not pass.There is no power in any religion now. There is only power in the generator ShivBaba.
This new knowledge is new, it is contemporary, it is for us, it is given in these circumstances to live like that in this modern world and it is very easy and natural, because there is effort and hard work involved in doing something that is not natural to us. Purity is the eternal form of every soul. Now we just get back to where we started.
And it is different. It is said that one has to become pure through God. The monk who does he become pure through. Or in the BK? They give a promise in front of an institution or a bodily guru, so the reward is accordingly. The monk can receive a status in the hierarchy of the church or one can receive a high vision from the guru or society. But if one promises in front of God, that I’ll remain pure ... if the monk brakes the promise ... he'll have to leave the church I guess, nothing more. Then in front of God the benefit and loss is more.
It is this matter where there is victory and defeat. To be king means to not be influenced. Our aim is to become free from desire. It is possible. In the scriptures Shankar is said to have burnt the deity of lust. This is an old aim given in the old Gita of bakti too /Oh, man Arjun, lust is your greatest enemy, conquer it/. Till this time no one could have reach it, because it is only the deity Shankar that does it and the rest does it numberwise and this deity is created only when the Supreme Soul Shiva comes, and till this moment He had not have been come and now He had come. The test is for becoming nashtomoha /detached/. The souls belonging to the sundinasty will have these qualities. Vishnu also is shown lying on the snake.
It is good to practice purity because peace comes out of it and happiness that is not happiness of the bodily organs but of the mind and intellect like soul. If anyone can show me a method or a place where I can learn how to control my mind ... there is no such other place, because in order for the intellect to control the mind it needs the reigns of Shrimat and there is only one ShivBaba who gives Shrimat. If we follow this Shrimat we succeed, otherwise we always have our own intellect to decide, that has now become degraded.
That's why I believe first we have to accept for ourselves that we are now impure. People, wonder why should one study and practice. I wonder whether they think for themselves they are perfect, whether they have an aim in their efforts, in their life, whether they see a reason to improve. When we conquer this one enemy all other weaknesses we have already conquered and there is no other effort.
And for this practice there is only one practice to consider oneself a soul. It is better even not to look others as souls but to look oneself as a soul. We have to become introverted.
In order to practice, one does not need any tools or to go anywhere. Everything is already present, the soul, the body, ShivBaba, ShivBaba’s knowledge, time, what we need is courage and enthusiasm. We do have these too that we use in useless, side matters. Тhе matter of conquering lust is of utmost importance. The world will be renewed with this practice.
It is said that we should race. Off I go ... meet you at the final.
Maybe it is not correct to say he controls our power, but steals our mind.
- 1. When is one supposed to become desireless when he has the desire to be desireless? If to be pure means to only have pure desires, that person is not desireless ...
2. Why this absolute and recurring idea that to control one's mind and and one's soul, you have to control your sexuality? Or everything that you naturally enjoy? When do you enjoy a true link with the others? When do you let go? Or do you only experience relationships because you want to become pure? How do you live a true connection, based on something that is not and only for your benefit or under your control? or is not that becoming a slave to the desire of control?
3. Why should a promise broken in front of God be worse than a promise I break with myself? Does not God have infinite mercy and love for every living? Why should I except myself from his absolution? is not he all powerful? I don't understand how you can treat each and everyone equally, when you believe that in the end, they get numberwise and you get Golden Age ... Or is that wishful thinking?
4. is not a person who is pure supposed to see only the purity in others, not their weaknesses, since she can see the grand scheme behind their actions, and does not allow her intellect to wander? (is not Arjun a lovely guy? :D )
5. Is it true we can be in control, when the Drama was made so we wouldn't be? is not it an illusion
These are some of the issues that made me leave BK life. Can you please answer them? It won't make me go back, but I might be able to understand something ...
- abrahma kumar
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I too wonder whether Shiva is: A) The Almighty; or B) Mightily Hungry for Power.
Andrey had written that in December 2006 so maybe he has new insights to share with us.
Desireless will be when desires will be fulfilled. All souls desires will be fulfilled. Some have their desires fulfilled here in the old world where they experience it like heaven. For them even if God comes and offers heaven on the palm of the hand they say i don't have time for this. Some get their desires fulfilled in the heaven established by God. They don't feel comfortable in the man-made heaven. It is said if one has not tasted rasgula (sweet) he will not crave for it.
It is not a matter of inequality. no one will probably feel like being cheated, or feel a loss. It is said no one should be left out no one should complain that "I did not know why did you not tell me i could have also made efforts". Maybe if there will be regret in someone it will be that i did not make effort, although i knew i had to, although i could. It will be regret towards the self and not towards someone else like pointing a finger, that they were guilty.
One will be left alone with the self to realise that i had the pen in the hand to draw as much luck as i would like to draw and this is what i drew and now i see i could have drawn a lot more. And one will see that he will be getting this every Kalpa, so maybe he would accept it and live with it. All souls' roles pass through golden period. He has come to make all souls reach this initial golden stage. This is the inheritance along with liberation. Liberation in life.
To live and feel happy and don't feel sorrow. It is for all souls. However there are different souls yes, and they are not happy with the same things. It is said that if you put a worm and insect on clean place full of light they suffer and die. That's why heaven is not for everyone. Some prefer living in hell.
Can you explain what 'free from thoughts forever' actually means, in a simple, clear unfussy way?andrey wrote:Yes there is something deliberate in "Why is God powerful". We imagine powerful like big, strong. Can a point of light be powerful? What is the nature of his power? If he is free from thoughts forever, forever point of light, then is this power or weakness?
Maybe in our personal transformation, experiences and events, we can see God'd help and intervention. Apart from that, Baba always declares that he's also bound by Drama, so, he cannot change roles or events.Mr Green wrote:"Shouldn't the question be ... Is God powerful? I've seen no evidence of it. "
Everything is subject to the Law of Karma, so, even though we are children of the Supreme Judge, Dharamraj, actually works automatically. It seems that, to a certain extent, "the Godfather", is less powerful and a less useful connection than the lokik mafia Godfather.
It means that in Paramdham the Supreme Soul Shiva resides in thoughtless stage, but even when he comes in the body the stage is the same.
Dear br. Mr. Green,
Thoughts are more powerful than words and actions. Will you call someone who works a lot through the body to perform a task powerful, or someone who can make the same task happen only through words, or one who can do only through the power of mind. That's why he is authority. He may be thougthless, but is is also a powerful stage of the mind. Mind is there but it is as if it is not there.
The evidence of his power is that many people have dedicated a lot of time, money, energy in his favour. This forum itself is also a proof. If it were not him we would not be here chatting.
His power is in his unique ability to change old into new.
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