Is Brahmakumaris.info an impartial website?

Mainly DEDICATED to Ex-BKs.
A neutral forum for congenial discussions and reservations related to the Godly Knowledge between ALL parties.
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Do you consider http://brahmakumaris.info to be impartial?

Yes, it is impartial.
9
32%
It is impartial as it is possible to be.
11
39%
It could be more impartial.
4
14%
No, it is not impartial at all.
4
14%
 
Total votes: 28

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john
Reforming BK
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Post by john » 25 Nov 2006

I'd say that on average, the so called ex-s are more passionate about the Knowledge and values than any of the BKs that have walked this way and the churning on this forum is very deep. Correct me if I am wrong.
There have been a good percentage of BKs posting on the forum even saying they aren't that bothered about the (Sakar) Murlis. Now that did get me thinking as to what is going down at the BK camp these days.

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sweetchill
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Post by sweetchill » 25 Nov 2006

Well ex-l, so far, I cannot find anyone on this forum (including you) who has given me any valid reason for why this site can justify its claim to be impartial. I haven't made any claims about whether I, other BK sites or the BKs themselves are impartial - that is not the point of my original post (which I keep trying to point out). Are your other questions deliberate misdirection on your part or do you just genuinely not get what I am saying?

The author of this site chooses not to post on this forum and engage in debate themselves (as far as I can tell) and so is just as unaccountable as any case of a BK senior that plenty on here are happy to moan about.

I am not getting drawn on other issues in this thread. There's plenty of time for that :D.

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john
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Post by john » 25 Nov 2006

I am not getting drawn on other issues in this thread. There's plenty of time for that
Then why should anyone get drawn into talking to you anymore on this thread. BK tactics don't work around here, it's a totally different 'arena'.

My guess is you are going to try and draw out this thread because it's the only thing you have to cling onto, then disappear, when it comes to answering more 'challenging' questions. Especially if you have been sent by the BK camp because that wont allow you to answer.

You've had lots of replies to the thread already, what about making it a two way street?

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bansy
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Post by bansy » 25 Nov 2006

sweetchill wrote:"But please just don't keep lurking around, it's frightening, almost feels like stalking." What are you on about?
Well your very first words into the forum were;
sweetchill wrote:Hello all,

First-time poster, reasonably long-time lurker.
With all this time you've had lurking around, you could have tried to answer at least one of the numerous topics raised in the various forums that BKs have so far not been able to reply. Well, let's see if you can summon up that courage, we're going to wait and see if you do. People on this forum are seeking the truth as much as everyone else is, BKs or otherwise.
John wrote:(reply to sweetchill) My guess is you are going to try and draw out this thread because it's the only thing you have to cling onto, then disappear, when it comes to answering more 'challenging' questions, especially if you have been sent by the BK camp because that wont allow you to answer.
My very thoughts too.

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sweetchill
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Post by sweetchill » 25 Nov 2006

John wrote:BK tactics don't work around here
You guys seem to have more in common with the tactics you apparently abhor than you're obviously aware. No matter what I say on any subject, you guys will just assume I am playing BK games - as that is the mindset most of you probably have about ANY argument a BK gives that doesn't support your views.

That's pretty much already proved by the fact that a simple question cannot even get a straight answer from YOU on this threat. I'll ask again, if you would like another opportunity: "How can you justify the claim of this website that it is IMPARTIAL"? And I am the one playing games.

Bansy - by the fact that I've started posting suggests I've stopped "lurking". Or would you rather I did not? But we can end this threat here ... I know you are keen to talk about other matters. :)

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john
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Post by john » 25 Nov 2006

sweetchill wrote:But we can end this threat here ... I know you are keen to talk about other matters.
I am sure threat was just a Freudian slip and you really meant thread?

OK, I can only give my opinion, as I am not running this site. Awareness is being made of issues concerning the BKs, that they would wish to be hidden. Just like a lokik company would want things hidden to keep it's image clean, except this is no ordinary company it is part of the Godly Yagya. So I ask again, where are our Godly jewels of knowledge, who stole them, who is hiding them?

Are you interested in Shrimat or BKmat, there is a difference ...
No matter what I say on any subject, you guys will just assume I am playing BK games - as that is the mindset most of you probably have about ANY argument a BK gives that doesn't support your views.
That really is not the case. What BKs fail to understand is this is all built into drama, the failings of BKness is all built in and there for a significant reason, so why hide from the truth, it is always beneficial as ShivBaba would say.

Do you know of ShivBaba or has he been written out yet, in favour of Trimurti Dadis?

As a gesture of good faith, is it possible for you to at least answer one question for now? You have had answers in your thread, just not the one you are looking for.

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fluffy bunny
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Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: ex-BK. Interested in historical revisionism, failed predictions and abuse within the BK movement.

Post by fluffy bunny » 25 Nov 2006

sweetchill wrote:There's plenty of time for that.
Well, are you going to state what exactly it is that you find to be impartial ... ?

I disagree with your interpretation of the meaning of impartial. Webster states; "treating or affecting all equally". This is the only place where BK, PBKs, ex-BKs, Friends and Family of BKs get together and discuss matters openly and transparently. Good heavens, the PBKs - who strike me as having at least an equal love of BK Gyan - are barred from everywhere else, centres or forums. I will try one last time ... there is a whole heap of stuff on this site, where does one start? Offer your alternative re-write and we will can compare the two.

My own honest personal response to your question is, "frankly ... who cares either way? It is still the most interesting BK Raja Yoga related forum, if not website, on the internet". I have learned much more about the Knowledge and the BKWSU in the last 6 months or so than all my previous years. Where members cannot give answer, it raises very interesting questions.

You mentioned The Experience page, here it is;
These beliefs include ;
• belief in the imminent destruction of this world by unavoidable Nuclear Holocaust, [now overdue by 30 years]
• belief in themselves as the only true messengers of God
• belief that God only speaks to them and them alone in person at their Indian headquarters via a channeller
• hypnagogic, trance-like practises and repetitive auto-suggestion
• fixation on attracting VIPs to enhance their credibility and act as "microphones" for their message
• exaggerated distinction between "pure" [their teachings and activities] and "impure" [the rest of the World's opinions and leaders]
• exaggerated sense of self-importance [they being topknot "Brahmins"], the rest of the World [Untouchables or "Shudras"]
• belief in an unrealistic view of science, e.g. all of time existing within one endlessly repeating 5,000 year timeframe
• a slow and gradual re-writing of their core beliefs as they fail
unquestionable and unaccountable non-democratic leadership
• amassing of considerable wealth from followers under such pressures
• complete separation from non-BKs by complete control of diet, demanding lifestyle, celibacy
• graphic exaggeration of the plight of those that leave the group ; "grinding of teeth like the sound of mustard seeds ... crying tears of blood at Destruction", sexual activity being like "throwing one's self from a 5th storey high building", having to face a severe God at Judgement Day
• secrecy, revision and disguise of the nature and process of teachings
intense and long lasting social and psychological problems within individuals leaving the organisation.

So, please let us know which element do you think is impartial ... incorrect ... misleading ... what ever it is you want to accuse?


Probably folks have nothing to say because it is not that interesting a topic. Their time is limited and they would prefer to discuss issues relating to Gyan. I suppose if the BKWSU wanted to discredit this site, they could have loads of BKs come along and start topics seeding doubt or sowing discontent but what you pose is really a non-question. Thankfully, most of the card carrying BKs that come to this site, and came to xBKChat, are genuine, interesting and independently minded.

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bansy
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Post by bansy » 25 Nov 2006

by the fact that I've started posting suggests I've stopped "lurking". Or would you rather I did not?
Well, glad you've stopped lurking because it could just make one wonder do you always lurk around websites ... do you always ask each blog or website or webpage or whatever in your life to decide, if this or that is impartial, partial, neutral, clean, dirty, etc? That's a lot of websites to go through on the net.
There's plenty of time for that.
Not sure, Destruction is always there. The Avyakt Murli narrated via Dadi Gulzar on 16 Nov 2006 points out the importance of time.

Anyway, now you've stepped in, you'll have to wriggle your way out ... as a starter, try answering say any one of the Qs ex-l has posted. I cannot answer them. Regarding your "question", it's also too difficult for me, as I am way past deciding what is impartial or partial or a belief or disbeliefs to be concerned about the entirely. After all this is good old Kaliyug and a lot of funny things happening during this so-called Confluence Age.

By the way, my first post to you was Welcome to the forum. I do mean it. As I have several good BKs whom I have close contact with and discuss matters, though does not always get very far. I don't mind, as they don't mind. They are souls just like me and everyone else here.

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mr green
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Post by mr green » 26 Nov 2006

This is a silly thread really. Out of the whole website this guy has managed to find one word!! He feels he can take issue with, and by his own admission even that issue is just his opinion.

He doesn't want to discuss it. He just puts the same thing in capital letters. Just silly, trying to obtain some sort of admission. If you think this site is no good because of one word you don't like, just don't come on here.

Otherwise just get off the soapbox and enjoy what this site has to offer. You'll find you can discuss matters of Gyan here in a totally open and interesting way, rather than just swallowing what the Seniors say.

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arjun
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Location: India

Post by arjun » 26 Nov 2006

ex-l wrote:Offer your alternative re-write and we will can compare the two.
I fully agree with ex-l on this issue. If Sweetchill is really serious about discussing this topic of impartiality he/she should give an alternative re-write. If he/she wants he/she can get the matter approved by the BK administration and post it here. The Admin and/or other members can decide how far the suggestions given by Sweetchill could be incorporated on the desired page of the website.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

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eromain
ex-BK
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Post by eromain » 27 Nov 2006

sweetchill wrote:As for the child abuse claims - as far as I can tell there are two individuals in the organisation's 70 years history. For me, THAT is a sign of the genuine spiritual ethos of the organisation. Any other similar organisation that faced the forensic examination that Eugene has given would have uncovered MANY MANY more - that's not in any way an excuse for what happened, but that is a reality of the world we are living in today.

Eugene has done some good - the organisation now has much better child protection procedures. But does anyone think he has pursued his cause with pure motive? You, he and others on here might want to think so ... but it's simply not the case.
Dear sweetchill,

Please explain what my real motives were in my child abuse work.

Thanking you,

Eugene

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sweetchill
BK
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Post by sweetchill » 27 Nov 2006

Dear Eugene,

You find the BKs at times repulsive - I believe you said this yourself or words to similar effect.

You think that attitude is going to lead to honourable motives with your child abuse stuff? Feel free to tell yourself that, if it makes you feel better. You've left the BKs with bitterness. You obviously don't think that colours your motives in any way? In my opinion, you have embarked on a campaign of bullying and harrassment of sisters that I have a lot of respect and love for - which means my impressions of you are coloured, too (I am happy to accept that).

Don't get me wrong - your BK child abuse crusade has improved the child safety policies at BK centres. But - in my humble opinion - you've been pretty desperate to find more examples of child abuse, indeed WANTED to find them. That's quite sad. I admit I might be totally wrong on this - but that is my impression of you and your motives.(you did ask)

Chill ...

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sweetchill
BK
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Cockroaches

Post by sweetchill » 27 Nov 2006

It's all about context, I guess.

If had found a cochroach in a pack of mushrooms from Tesco and I said that "Tescos are known to have cochroaches in their mushrooms", then strictly speaking that is true. But it would skew the bigger picture - it sells millions of packs of mushrooms without cochroaches in them.

OK, so comparing the BKs to Tesco is a bit silly. But you get my point ... you might have a totally relevant experience, but by including it in an article about the BKs in a wikipedia article, does your experience get given undue weight compared to the experiences of many thousands of others?

Anyway, it's not down to you or me at the end of the day ... wikipedia is bigger than both of us. :D

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eromain
ex-BK
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Post by eromain » 28 Nov 2006

Dear Sweetchill,

When did I say I find the BKs repulsive???

When did I say I left the BKs with bitterness??

Who have I bullied and harassed?

And on what basis can you claim I have been desperate to find more examples of child abuse?

And how on earth can you make such categorical statements and then say you might be wrong? Why might you be wrong? Are you just guessing ? If you doubt the veracity of what you say how can you justify saying it?

Thanking you

Eugene

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sweetchill
BK
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Post by sweetchill » 28 Nov 2006

Dear Eugene - I say I might be wrong, because I might be.

But you asked me for my opinion and I've given it.

I say again - if you can say in all honesty that your intentions are honourable, then good for you.

I don't think they are. It's an opinion.

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