Official Contact with Sister Jayanti BKWSU (UK) - legal

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Post by admin » 12 Oct 2007

We attempted to contact Sister Jayanti about the ongoing legal dispute via the given email address, her assistant Alka Patel. Please note the BKWSU is still blocking our emails.
Subject: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender
Date: 12 October 2007 04:25:09 BDT
To: info@brahmakumaris.info

This message was created automatically by mail delivery software.

A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its
recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed:

Alka.Patel@uk.BKWSU.org

SMTP error from remote mail server after RCPT TO:<Alka.Patel@uk.BKWSU.org>:
host ap.datacastsys.com [207.210.88.123]: 550 Blocked

------ This is a copy of the message, including all the headers. ------
We have sent an email to all forum members requesting support in the defence of this legal action.

Please contact us if you can help at; info@brahmakumaris.info

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BKWSU (UK) legal matters

Post by admin » 10 Jul 2008

Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual University (UK) has appointed a solicitor to handle matters relating to charity law and governance.

Any further correspondence should be directed to; Shivaji Shiva - Associate, Head of Charity Law

Michelmores LLP, Woodwater House, Pynes Hill, Exeter, EX2 5WR

E; tss@michelmores.com

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by paulkershaw » 10 Jul 2008

Flip, they've even got the right name for their lawyer. That must have taken a while to find.

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by fluffy bunny » 11 Jul 2008

paulkershaw wrote:Flip, they've even got the right name for their lawyer. That must have taken a while to find.
I am sorry but I am tempted to break into song with Gerard Kenny over this one; "New York, New York ... So Good They Named It Twice"

Shivaji Shiva Solicitor ... so good they named him twice after God. I wonder if they have told him yet about the other God Shiva coming to earth and possessing Lekhraj Kirpalani to lead us all to the Golden Age by way of Destruction!?!

OK, some background to this. As much as I hate the whole "name and fame" game ... back on March 6th I wrote in a personal capacity to the Global Chief of the BKWSU, Janki Kripalani in India. For all these months, I chased her for a response and received no response. The BKWSU in the UK emailed back to suggest a mediator but I refused as the matters were of such a level, and international in nature, that only someone with the authority of Janki could address them.

I felt that this was merely a distraction but I did however go ahead to pursue the issues of both the public supply of the Murlis and an attempt to stop the PBK beatings with this UK based mediator. Even if their marital partner is a long term BK. So let us see what they come back with over those issues and what this is all about.

I loath being dragged down to a level of personalities but as the BKWSU are now apparently targeting me so personally it seems impossible for me to avoid. I want to avoid it reflecting on the work of others and this forum or website. I am, frankly, disgusted that such a high funded and so-called Spiritual University, with 70 years of tradition is unable to address such simple issues as transparency, accountability and duty of care on their own without having to target individuals for raising such issues.

More later as it happens ...

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by bansy » 11 Jul 2008

Please raise your left hand and place your right hand on the Bible ... No ... Gita ... no ... Vani ... no ... Murli ... oh never mind ... and repeat after me, "I solemnly swear to tell the real truth ( :shock: ), the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help me ... errrr ... God ??! " By the way, you may elect the God of your choice". :D

Gandhi, as a qualified lawyer, and the number of times he stood trial, must have had trouble with this.

Has Lekhraj Kirpalani and Virendra Dev Dixit gone to court before ? What words did they use to swear oath ?

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by fluffy bunny » 12 Jul 2008

I understand that the BKWSU (UK) is currently "in discussion" with the Privy Council and Charity Commission over its misuse of the protect title "University". Basically, one is not allowed to use it without official sanctions ... which, of course, they never had.

I have decided because, and ONLY because, these letters were not honored with a proper response even 4 months later and after much chasing, to publicly document them. In truth, what I set out to do ... and offer the leadership of the BKWSU ... was a public test to demonstrate their ethics. There is no point claiming to the "highest of the high" if one's action contradict that ... so to follow is what has passed so far.

I wrote with some suggestions on how the BKWSU could improve its public image and resolve outstanding issues ... and with a simple request regarding how to could report serious financial abuse asking how serious it had to be before they would take action and what sort of punitive sanctions they would apply.


Firstly, can anyone explain to me why one of the 'top 8' souls in the world of all time and future Golden Aged Emperor "King" Janaki Kripalani, who is supported by someone widely speculated within the Brahma Kumari movement to be one of the 'top 108' souls of all time and future Golden Age royal family Jayanti Kirpalani; who is herself supported by such powerful Brahma souls themselves lawyers, intellectuals and academics; all of whom are surrounded by the creme of BK Brahmin society ... have to revert to the so-called "impure intellect" of a so-called "Shudra non-BK" and such "devilish" activities as the law. ... as BapDada would call them? That is presuming that this Mr Shiva is actually a non-BK follower.

It had me confused for a while. Then I think I realised why, I wonder what others think ... the only assumption I can make is that they do not want to put into writing, or be seen to put into writing, themselves. They appear to me to prefer to operate only in an unaccountable verbal manner ... the secreting away of the Murlis from the public eye being an obvious case.

I was confused too why the BKWSU (UK) was responding to me when I clearly wrote to the office of the global chief in India and, I presume, the 'World Renewal Trust'. I mean, one of the problems in addressing the "Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual University" is that it, basically, does not seem to exist anywhere despite even all the advertising and self-promotion.

As the leadership allows each zone to rename itself as however it best suits their interest, the BKWSU appears to be largely a figment of the mind of Lekhraj Kirpalani, or the channelled entity eponymously named Shiva. There is a Murli quote to support the instruction of it uses but I do not have it at hand. He said "no one would mind". That was not actually true. He did also say it should be "Prajapita Brahma Kumari" but let us not be distracted by that right now.

So, I started to wonder if by the Brahma Kumaris in the UK responding, the Brahma Kumaris Globally could deny responsibility for actions instructed or carried out in other zones. One zone having no authority over any other zone. The lawyer ONLY represents the BKWSU (UK). Under English Law he and they will quite easily be able to refute any responsibility for non-UK related issues. I have raised this issue with the solicitor and await clarification. I have no idea what they are up to this time ... let us see and, hopefully, be positively surprised.

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by fluffy bunny » 22 Jul 2008

I am making public the two letters I sent on 6 March 2008 but which have not yet, as of 22 July 2008, been acknowledged at all by Pope Janki Kripalani or the BKWSU in India.

Very specifically, I would like others to realise what I am doing here and I want to make a couple of points very clear.

After 5 months of institutional ignorance, whilst the pair of them have flown around the world together meeting VIPs and big business people, after a response insipid to the point of dishonesty and now the appointment of another lawyer, I am choosing to make the matter entirely public, so they and their appointed solicitor can read it to if they so wish.
  • We are not who we say we are. We are what we do and what we did. This is as true of ourselves as individuals as it is of ourselves as institutions. It is as true of me as it is the so-called and numinous BKWSU. What I am doing here is offering the BKWSU a chance to prove its ethics in public. What I have done and I am doing here is offer them sufficient evidence of a clearly unethical situation and showing how they personally and institutionally respond to it.
In the following letters I am lobbying the BKWSU about two issues.

1) I think they should make Colonel BK Hansa Raval repay the legal costs for the legal action she started against this website because there is clear evidence of its personalised motivation and use of BKWSU facilities, good name etc in the correspondence from involved BKWSU members.

I would like to make it clear that, a) I, personally, will not benefit from this in any way and b) those individuals that supported the legal defense of this website have never themselves requested repayment. It is not a matter of "the money" but "the ethics".

2) I am also lobbying the BKWSU to resolve the current situation between them and the AIVV/PBKs. It sickens me to think that I once gave two seconds of my life to an organization that while at the same time as leeching its way around the United Nations to gain credibility as God's "angels of light" (never mind leech off the tax payers of numerous developed nations as a so-called CHARITY) can instruct or allow members of its "security wing" to beat the ******* out of people with lathis (riot sticks) and destroy others property in numerous Indian states whilst referring to co-religionists as "viruses". The BKWSU appears to think that whilst it is quite permissible for them to apply their devious approaches to promote their religion at other faith's religious events, it is not permissible for anyone else to ... openly ... do the same to their events, as PBKs have done.

I would like to make it clear that, a) I am not a PBK follower, b) I have not studied PBK teachings c) nor have the AIVV requested that I intercede on their behalf and I do not necessarily condone all and every act carried by any PBK. The two groups have issues, they need to resolve them without the BKWSU, or individuals within the BKWSU, choosing to rely on violence, intimidation and punishment through banishments.

For those keen students of Reformation history, you may say this is my 'Jenny Geddes moment'.
Jenny Geddes wrote:"Deil colic the wame o’ ye, fause thief; daur ye say Mass in my lug?"
which means in English,

"Devil cause you severe pain and flatulent distention of your abdomen, false thief: dare you say the Mass in my ear?"

I would like individuals to understand that by making this all open and public I am, essentially, staking the odds against myself and giving them more ground to attack me or more grounds to ignore me. But I am doing so to give them an opportunity to do so. To prove themselves. In my opinion, they are only using lawyers again to wash their hands of being seen and recorded of doing something and primarily expressing their own, and their organization's own ... true self.

Amen.
Janki Kripalani
BKWSU International Headquarters
Pandav Bhawan
Post Box No 2
Mount Abu Rajasthan 307501

6 March 2008


Dear Madam,


Congratulations on your recent appointment to the position of titular head of the World Renewal Trust. We at BrahmaKumaris.Info are heartened to hear that issues relating to your organisation’s reform are finally being taken more seriously. We hope you can extend that commitment to include the establishment of an independent ombudsperson system and resolving issues of considerable and previously undisclosed historical revision that current blights the Trust’s public reputation. I enclose a copy of a letter to Jayanti Kirpalani underlining our suggestions.

I am writing in order to recover the legal costs incurred by BrahmaKumaris.Info following Colonel Hansa Raval’s recent personally motivated and ill-advised legal action against us. As I am sure you know, the decision of the National Arbitration Forum was unanimously in our favour.

I can assure you that I am neither seeking nor will I receive any personal benefit from this recompensation and that the costs will be returned to individuals that have already given more than most to the BKWSU. The evidence we have clearly states that Colonel Raval and others were using the charity to pursue her own personal interests. This would be a serious enough matter in a lokik environment. We have come to expect higher principles within an alokik environment.

We consider that this now is a matter of principle which raises serious implications about the financial and legal structure by which your international organisation operates. We will clearly evidence to you that the action had personal motivations and that, essentially, individuals within your organization are using the property and facilities of legally the registered charities for their own personal and financial benefit and will argue why they should be personally responsible for them.

On the successful resolution of this matter, we also request a formal accountable method by which we can address other equally questionable practises.

BrahmaKumaris.Info is a unique, independent and ecumenical voice within the Brahmin family. Members are promoting a policy of openness, honesty and exacting detail documenting all matters relating to the lifestyle and philosophy promoted by the movement and its effected communities including the friends and families of BKs, ex-BKs, PBKs and others.

We are committed to making full use of modern technology in order empower others without the limitations set upon them by the current management of the World Renewal Trust and its subsidiaries.

We would like to use this occasion to formally request a complete copy of the original and unedited Murlis in text format (Hindi and English), the Divine Decrees, the likes of the 'Vartman Mahabhari Mahabharat Larai aur Unka Parinam' volumes and other requested documents relating to the social and philosophical development of the religion for our members’ and academic study. Where these are apparently no longer available, for example the missing years of Murlis, we would like to request that their lack of existence is accounted for.

In addition, we also request your assurance that we may receive an uninterrupted and unconditional supply of current Murlis in text format, equivalent to any other BK center of learning, which will be shared with the many other BKs documented as requesting the same on our forum.

Essentially what we are offering the BKWSU is an opportunity to re-establish its goodwill and credibility as “God’s representatives on earth”, merely saving us time, effort and our beneficiaries further delays. I am sure that I do not need to remind you that the time of turmoil is close and that Baba not only encourages us to do whatever we need to do quickly but that everyone should be satisfied with us.

To the best of our understanding, given the lack of confidence and visible reform, individual members of BrahmaKumaris.Info are independently in correspondence with and raising issue of public concern responsible to other organizations. Neither I, personally, nor we, collectively, accept responsibility for such actions.

There is also a general and widespread concern amongst our members, and other groups, that the Brahma Kumaris have exploited and exaggerated their relationship with the United Nations. It would appear that this has been of primary benefit to the Brahma Kumaris’ own reputation and has been used in an attempt to establish your own credibility rather than the sincerely adopt the UN charter would is contradictory and mutually exclusive to the many Brahma Kumari practises and belief such as the desirability and inevitability of Destruction.

With your agreement, and so as remove any element of suspicion, I suggest that the BKWSU corresponds directly with our legal representatives, Sprecher Grier Halberstam LLP and that it ensures internally that Colonel Raval repays our costs. We remain critical that an individual Brahma Kumari, with considerable personal savings and income, could financially benefit by encouraging donations and improvements made to her own personally mortgaged and registered property from individuals with very little income.

We also have other serious concerns regarding the professional conduct and financial practises in the BKWSO (USA) that we wish to raise in the future.

Lastly, during the domain dispute, we were approached by Dr Ray Bhatt who informed us that he was acting on your request for information and evidence regarding the Colonel’s marriage, divorce and subsequent conduct within Gyan. This was relevant as the Colonel refuted, despite widespread documentation, the divisive effect of the Brahma Kumaris upon families in her pleadings.

We provided for him not all but sufficient evidence addressed in a letter to you and Jayanti Kirpalani. Remarkably, this was instead immediately supplied to Colonel Patel, re-edited to appear if it was sent directly to her and then returned by her attorneys to ours as an alleged blackmail attempt in writing. I would like confirmation whether Dr Bhatt was indeed acting with your knowledge and on your behalf or if we were deceived.


Yours sincerely,


Evidence.

The following enclosed correspondences, clearly evidence that the matter was personal, and that there have been what most would think considerable abuses of position within the American non-profit 501(c) organization and British charity.

On 1 November 2008 written by BKWSU Internet PR Team member Simon Blandford and sent to BK Luis Riveros of the Tampa Center in which Simon refers to other correspondence between members of the IT team and clearly states;


• 1 November 2008, Simon Blandford wrote:

“If you've been following the events on the BKI site you may be aware that they think the BKWSU is trying to contest ownership of the brahmakumaris.info domain.

Actually, it turns out to be part of a personal defamation case brought about by sister Hansa in TX since what they said about her medical claims etc was libel.

I don't fully understand the specifics and it would be improper for me to forward the email.”


• On 11th September 2007, Alka Patel wrote:

“Regarding your e-mail dated 11th September 2007 which states: 'On 12.24 pm Sept 10 2007, the BKWSU or BKWSO filed a National Arbitration Forum dispute against the registrant of the domain', we wish to inform you that the Brahma Kumaris World Spiritual University has not filed any such dispute.”


On 16th June 2007 an alleged supporter of Colonel Hansa Patel, choosing to call himself ‘Mike Peace’, posted onto our forum, beyond any reasonable interpretation of the law, legal threatens made towards a young journalist on behalf of “her legal counsel, the US Department of Defense and the US Pentagon ... towards the authors of the fictitious article and any website posting the article.

• On 16th June 2007, ‘Mike Peace’, wrote;

“ If you do not adhere to the above notifications the following legal actions to be pursued through
United States legal channels to prevent your use of US resources to propagate misinformation:

1. Calvin Chin to be banned from all United States based domain registration or site hosting.
2. Calvin Chin to be banned from submitting articles to any United States based online site.
3. Class Action Suit against Calvin Chin for damages caused to all cancer patients misdirected by the article.

The following have already been contacted regarding this issue:

1. United States Department of Defense
2. Embassy of the United States, Kuala Lumpur.”

It is clear that intention of these posts were to intimidate and send an aggressive message to ourselves quite contradictory and unrepresentative of the spirit of Brahma Kumari Raja Yoga, entirely in Colonel Hansa personal interest and censorial of the values of freedom of speech and right to free assembly, in our case on the internet, enshrined in the majority of developed democracies.

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by fluffy bunny » 22 Jul 2008

Dear Jayanti,


I enclose a letter for Janki Kripalani regarding the final resolution of the BrahmaKumaris.Info domain name dispute and other issues. Please excuse the direct manner of this approach and my apologies for not accepting your earlier offer of a “friendly conversation”. I presume that being aware we were party much of the internal correspondence about our domain and internet PR team related matters and had faced the conduct of certain of its members, you will understand that we realised that the offer could not be taken at face value.

For the want of the knowledge of any formal system with which to address such matters, we request that you forward this letter to Janki Kripalani in her position as the global chief administrator of the World Renewal Trust. Obviously with doing so we are respecting your own position of natural authority with the BK system. We have no confidence in these matters being handled professionally in the American zone and request they are given your attentions.

During the domain dispute, we were approached by Dr Ray Bhatt, informing us that he was acting for Janki Kripalani. Specifically on her behalf, he requested information and evidence regarding the Colonel Hansa Patel’s marriage and divorce within Gyan as well as her subsequent conduct towards ex-BKs and their family. This was relevant as the Colonel refuted, despite widespread documentation, the divisive effect of the Brahma Kumaris upon families in her pleadings whilst not refer to her own first marriage and the child she left, as we understand it, to pursue a commitment in the BKWSO.

We provided for Dr Bhatt sufficient evidence, from public sources, in a letter addressed to you personally on the understanding that it would be relayed to Janki Kripalani. Remarkably, this letter was instead immediately supplied to Colonel Patel, re-edited in an amateur fashion so as to appear if it was sent directly to her and then returned by her attorneys to ours as an alleged blackmail in a dishonest attempt to discredit us in writing. I would like confirmation whether Dr Bhatt was indeed acting on your behalf and with your knowledge or if we were misled.

We are concerned by reports from BK followers that the members of our forum are being represented as an “anti-party” by the leadership of the BKWSU and that the domain dispute came about because we refused to meet with you. This is not what our records support. I am very aware at how the former fits in to the BK theodicy but I can assure you that it is far from the truth. The BrahmaKumaris.Info forum represents the broadest spectrum of BK related interests and is a unique, independent and ecumenical voice within the movement. It is arguably both the leading resource for documentary evidence and only open forum for mutual discussion and support.

Collectively, members are deeply concerned the ongoing commercialisation of Gyan, the lack of clarity between service and private enterprise, and the revisions, exclusivity and secrecy that now surrounds the core teachings. Until provided with evidence to the contrary will remain convinced that what is considered to be Godly knowledge should be freely available to all, as best as our efforts and technology can provide. As Baba says in the Murli, “there is no question of ownership” in these matters.

To this end, you will note our request for a copy of the complete collection of original unedited Murlis and regular updates on an equal basis with any other center of BK learning.

I have taken time to go over the report of the ‘Review Process on Global Functioning’, from the NCO meetings of 3 – 7 Feb 2008 and would appreciate if you could forward a copy of the ‘Centre Coordinators’ Manual, March 2003’ and ‘BKIVV Constitution and By-Laws, July 2007’ preferably in text format and by email.

As you are personally involved with issues related to conflict resolution and reconciliation, we would like to make it clear that we would not consider outstanding oversights in this area resolved until an fully accountable independent and external body was established. We suggest that you explore the model established by ISKCONResolve (http://www.iskconresolve.com/). Further more, the issues raised by the recent domain dispute and other incidents underline the need for a well advertised formal complaints mechanism. It would seem to us that your organization is confusing a “culture of care” and with its representatives’ legal “duty of care” of which there seems no mention.

We wish to raise a number of very serious professional conduct issues that would seem to us not only be morally questionable, contrary to the Maryadas that we understand Brahma Kumaris are bound by but also to have serious legal implications. To whom and how can we raise these?

Lastly, may I also underline your organization’s need to address matters of the considerable historical and philosophical revision that has occurred through out its history. These are currently being sustained by misleading and idealised hagiographies presented as truths to vulnerable neophytes. I appreciate that this might be traditional in India but I would suggest that a lack of accuracy and transparency in these matters will be counter-productive in the long-term.

We have been discovering that many ex-BKs would never have made the commitment and donations to your leaderships had they been aware of the previous history of revision, failed predictions of Destruction and so on. Members would be very interested to see evidence of how and when the first revelation of Shiva’s involvement in your religion came about as it would seem all the early publications we have seen make no reference to him to at least after early 1950s.

In my experience, I can honestly say that there is nothing more destroying of one’s faith to discover that one has been wilfully misled, lied to or had uncomfortable truth covered up by individuals presenting themselves as God’s representatives. It is very difficult at this stage for us not to believe that this was concerted arrangement performed on behalf of the early leadership and carried out since over a period of decades.

To this extent, we are also requesting a reliable open channel of communication where such anomalies can be address by the World Renewal Trust representatives and invite you personally to be interviewed for our website. We wish to conduct a series of email interviews with leading BKs and would like to offer you the opportunity to be our first.

We must draw to your attention that it would seems your IT team are still blocking our emails from arriving to your servers and hope that you can confirm for us a reasonable resolution of this matter.


Yours sincerely,

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by fluffy bunny » 22 Jul 2008

This, of 3 June 2008, is the only response received to date.

Now, frankly, what does Sister Jayanti expect anyone to think of such a response? "Most of the questions in your letter are related to the organisation in India and we are not able to obtain the necessary information to respond to these".

"Necessary information"? Can the organisation in India not reply to the letters it receives itself? Is Janki Kripalani not also the chief administrator of the United Kingdom charity as well? With hundred of unpaid staff and millions of Pounds worth of income ... what is so difficult to respond? Murlis aside, it is not information that is being requested of them.
Jayanti Kirpalani wrote:Thank you for your patience. Most of the questions in your letter dated 6th March 2008 are related to the organisation in India and we are not able to obtain the necessary information to respond to these.

However, I do believe that communication with a spirit of openness and dignity would help us move forward.

We have thought deeply about the issues you have raised and we would like to suggest that perhaps the next step is to have a neutral mediator. The person we suggest is Gerry German, director of the Communities Empowerment Network, a charity providing support for people experiencing mistreatment and discrimination in education. He is an experienced educator and former Principal Education Officer with the Commission for Racial Equality. Gerry's wife Patricia has been a BK since 1985; Gerry himself is not a BK.

If you feel that this is acceptable to you then we can put you directly in touch with each other.

Yours sincerely,


BK Jayanti
I refused the involvement of Gerry German because as a quote-unquote "non-self-realised, non-BK, Shudra", of course he has no authority in the running of the BKWSU. Someone with a BK wife of over 20 years was hardly going to be neutral. Why would "one of the 8" or 108 need to use him? My feeling was that it was only more deflection and obstruction ... runaround in other words.

I did however take the initiative and request that he assisted in two matters; a) given his interest in education, the public access to the Murlis and, b) as he is a 'Officer with the Commission for Racial Equality', the issue of the PBK beatings.
  • 3 weeks later I have, again, had no response.
So this is the reality of dealing with the Kripalani Klan. I did not want to have to make this correspondence public ... but ... enough is enough and my test of saintly patience is over. What are they doing? Expecting Destruction (the End of the World) to come and save them? Cross referencing eromain's recent post about the BKWSU response to the child sex abuse cover up ... it looks to me like a closed shop closing ranks "never explain, never apologise" just like the rule of other Kali Yugi royalty.

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by paulkershaw » 22 Jul 2008

Whilst everyone is apparently absorbing the impact of this development, another reality I am perceiving here is that the guns have most certainly been drawn. Very, very brave of you ex-l and I do note, behind the scenes, and now you've revealed the internal correspondence thas been going on, that your patience has been sorely tested. In my current experience, it seems to be a political and legal 'technique' to sometimes not answer a posed question or threat immediately. It's also a taught 'sales' technique that the first one who talks "loses"!

The behind the scenes incident about the letter being changed from within and returned to the legal teams is of no surprise I suppose, considering what is already documented, but it's now acting like a loose cannon in search of a target. I wonder if we'll ever find out who edited/altered that particular letter?

It seems now impossible for the BKWSU to move 'along' as they have been and will have to either ignore the situation (likely) or will have to have a meeting with all the joint region heads and come up with a plan which will unite and strengthen them (possible). Either way, the chai is steaming hot and its not a brand we can call "compromise" is it? The truth is well, not. That's gotta hurt.

The intense fragmentation within the BKWSU is obvious at this point as even the right hand to the Head of the BKWSU organisation (in its many forms), cannot and will not respond on a universal (or shall we say international) level. Its a pity as there's real opportunity now for dialogue and change but without full accountability, no exchange of dialogue can really take place, or am I asking too much here? How can they let go and supply the requested information, as it'll mean an intensely dramatic change for the BKWSU/O, not matter how they term you (and the 'members' of this forum)?

Where's their slogan "When I change the world changes" now? - I can fully understand your 'decision' not to accept the mediator offered by the BKWSU. Is there another available name up on offer anywhere else though? Reading 'between the lines' I wonder if a mediator is really needed as this may require "compromise" on some level and I doubt if many people on this forum will accept anything but the truth now that you've been instrumental in uncovering so much and standing your ground as you have been.

The danger to them is this: should they choose to come together as "one voice - one organisation" and make the required changes on an internal level (within the organisation), their membership will drop, as the biggest test will be the relationship each member has with the founder (in spirit) - as the 'truth is laid bare' for the world to read. Bear in mind that 'truth' is a strange word with even stranger meanings and in the hands of different cultures has even stranger understandings and can be twisted and turned to suit accordingly.

At the end of the day the strength of any organisation lies in its membership criteria and in its funding provided by and to said membership and with only the die-hards left, it seems that the BKWU will not and cannot continue in its present form.

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by bkti-pit » 23 Jul 2008

Thanks for making all of this public ex-l!

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tom
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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by tom » 23 Jul 2008

Hi, ex-l,

Please accept my respect for your good intentions and for your persistent loyalty to your own values system ... Your letters are lessons of honesty and wisdom to the“Keepers of Wisdom”

Retired Colonel Dr.med.BK Hansa Raval has taken officially on behalf of BKWSU an ill intended action against brahmakumaris.info, i.e. to take over the domain name. And lost the case. The fact that BKWSU leadership is rejecting to have known about this case does not matter anything. They could have stopped BK Raval. They haven’t stopped her also later as she made her application for the trademark of the BKWSU title and for the trademark of the Murlis, “God’s versions” for sales reasons, to raise funds for her charity work through internet.

Gİven the fact, the plaintiff is BKWSU, the Indian headquarter or UK headquarter or BK Dr.Hansa Raval, one of them has to pay the legal costs plus the total interest for delay, starting from the date in November 2008 at which
The arbitrators of National Arbitration Forum returned decision and the BKWSO has been been unanimously denied the transfer of this domain name to their ownership.
Now ex-l, it is your legal right, to seize upon their assets. I am surprised seeing your patience that you are still trying the humanitarian and friendly way of conflict resolution, i.e. correspondence. Disclosure of the letters in the forum is also a way of correspondence.

This is evidence that you are still offering an opportunity to Janki Kirpalani, Jayanti Kirpalani and General Secretary Nirwair and their advisers to act at least honestly and handle this situation according to their teachings. Not to mention their assertion to be divine, they are demonstrating now again to the whole world that they are not able to act even according to basic humanitarian principles and with integrity.

You are absolutely right not to accept the non-BK mediator. When the “closest ones to God” lie nonstop to innocent ones, and ignore all members' and ex-members' inherit rights, why to waste time with somebody who has no legal authority and has no idea of the leadership’s conduct? For example:
ex-l wrote to Jayanti Kirpalani:

We provided for Dr Bhatt sufficient evidence (about Hansa Patel's (Raval) conduct), from public sources, in a letter addressed to you personally on the understanding that it would be relayed to Janki Kripalani. Remarkably, this letter was instead immediately supplied to Colonel Patel (Raval), re-edited in an amateur fashion so as to appear if it was sent directly to her and then returned by her attorneys to ours as an alleged blackmail in a dishonest attempt to discredit us in writing. I would like confirmation whether Dr Bhatt was indeed acting on your behalf and with your knowledge or if we were misled.
For sure, you know that you will never get any honest answer to any of your questions but keep asking with patience.

I am not surprised from the usual dharna of the leadership and their right and left hands. This is for people with a low consciousness the typical way of handling difficult situations. Not answering to the point or postponing it to eternity. The aim is to irritate and to sicken the opponent. It is obvious that they are not even counseling their solicitors,who would probably discourage Jayanti Kirpalani to write the following sentence, with which she was trying to ridicule us but which is an evidence of her lack of humor:
Jayanti Kirpalani wrote to ex-l

Most of the questions in your letter dated 6th March 2008 are related to the organization in India and we are not able to obtain the necessary information to respond to these.
But i am surprised that they have not learned anything from the yukti of their internationally appreciated management gurus Brian, Ken, Mike and Marc how to solve such critical situations.

Madame and her Indian court, with their usual arrogance, are choosing to ignore your legal rights and our “birthright” to achieve the truth. On the other hand they know internally, that they are approaching inevitably the turning point where they have to admit bitterly how they used to fabricate the false history of Yagya and to manipulate the BKs making them believe that God of all humanity is coming to them and speaking through their mediums. But like all guilty ones they deny now the reality. It is only a matter of time. Wait and see.

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by fluffy bunny » 23 Jul 2008

I have in the past been accused of being "not royal" or not saying things in the "BK way". I have also experienced that "not saying things in the right manner" has been used as an excuse to ignore issues but, in response, I think that controlling or criticising individual's communication is a very common form of control in dysfunctional families or societies. I have no idea what "royal" means ... as far as I can see, "being royal" is synonymous with pretentiousness and hypocrisy.

Victims are ruled by fear of speaking out and the intimidation of what happens if they do. Even within BK society, we have discussed here the risks of doing so. Other effected victims are silenced by genuine fears of threats of interference towards their family. In many ways, although the Brahma Kumaris are (mostly) not a violent cult, some of their leadership, in my opinion, exhibit what I am calling here a very 'feminine expertise' in causing hurt, pain and confusion through very subtle manners.

I must say that rather than making an exposé here, "hanging up dirty linen" as they say or, laughably, "blackmailing"; what I am doing here is actually holding back more than I am saying out of some sense of decency and a limited loyalty to others involved ... not any BK leader. Information which would shake the faith of any right thinking BK follower and make them question their leadership. Bhatt said it was Big Mohini who immediately passed on the letter.

By writing that letter, and putting this in public, I am attempting to give the BKWSU leadership yet another chance to get their house in order by pointing out what was going on. They, the BKWSU leadership, all stood aside to allow the action exhibiting, in my opinion, their actual and opportunistic principles. I do not know how much Janki Kripalani was told by her courtiers but, for sure, Chief of Global PR Karuna Shetty even came forward to sign his name to it making it "official BKWSU" policy several months later. I was told the issue was lobbied around Madhuban.

Yes, sadly, I think you are right Tom and that I should not be so naive ... but let us all be surprised by their ability to transform themselves in order to transform the world. Yes, I think it all does give a useful insight into the inner workings of the BKWSU. If I was any one of them (and I remember, technically, I am amongst "the lowest of the low"), I would have taken an ethical stance and refused to become involved. My feeling is that that all secretly hoped she was successful and just went along with it because they were not paying for it.

What I think we should be waiting for are the accounts of the 501(c) not-for-profit trust BKWSO to be made public to see how it was paid for at their end and I hope all BKs ask if it was the best use of their donors' donations.

If it is not paid out of the BKWSO's donations ... why was it allowed to be done in the BKWSO name?

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by paulkershaw » 23 Jul 2008

ex-l wrote:
I have no idea what "royal" means ... as far as I can see, "being royal" is synonymous with pretentiousness and hypocrisy.

... and from what I see in the general media round me: ... Dysfunctional too.

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Re: BKWSU (UK) appoints legal representation

Post by fluffy bunny » 23 Jul 2008

I just wanted to underline somethings. For me, this issue is not about who won or not. It is about;
  • a) an individual BK using the facilities of the publicly registered charity or trust for their personal interests
    b) others BK assisting in that knowing it was for personal interests
    c) the administrators of the publicly registered charities or trusts then supporting those individuals knowing not just that there was were personal interests involved, but also that there had been fairly serious contraventions of the Maryadas.
Whether they won or lost is beside the point. (I received emails telling me the usual, that Baba said "victory is assured" etc). It is a questions of the individuals' and leadership's (of publicly registered charities or trusts) ethics and how they respond to having them closely documented and examined.

My personal opinion is that they have always regarded themselves as above any "Kali Yuga" "Shudra" laws and look down upon establishments such a Charity Commissions, tax departments and any other individuals; that it is all a big joke to them and despite all the spiritual bollocks, they have an utter disregard for other human beings and their "impure" lives.

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