WHICH IS CORRECT

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fluffy bunny
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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by fluffy bunny » 07 Aug 2012

Thank you ... it seems that you are learning a lot about internet discussion forums.

Yes, it is no big thing. Individuals are free to use their real name, or a nickname, however it pleases them. They can choose to be anonymous, or to identify themselves as they wish.


Some chose to be anonymous to avoid ego (name and fame), others to protect themselves from personal attacks within the BK movement.

It allows people the ground to be free, whilst still being real.

For me, it does not matter who said what ... I know that all the others are human beings ... but the quality of what is being said.

rmn

Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by rmn » 07 Aug 2012

My dear Soul brother-FB, u r not delivered u r Gyan for second question, u have simple written about u r pride. Pl deliver u r Gyan for how to do Yoga with sweet baba. ShivBap sent me here to educate my self and to educate u by shivabap's discussions.
• thank
• OK

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fluffy bunny
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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by fluffy bunny » 07 Aug 2012

rmn wrote:how to do Yoga with sweet Baba.
I cannot and do not recommend that you have any Yoga with the god of the BKs at all.

He is not the god of all. You are free to do so if you want but please, for your own sake and others, do not delude yourself it is the god of all religions.

At best, it is just Lekhraj Kirpalani. At worst, it is some kind of deluding spirit ... or perhaps both. It seems that Lekhraj Kirpalani was possessed or influenced by some strange spirit. It seems to be here to create confusion and conflict between individuals.

rmn

Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by rmn » 07 Aug 2012

My dear sould brother FB,
Now u tell me how to do Yoga with shivabap not baba.
Pl tell u r experiences since 1981 and tell all of us on discussion forum and u will do a wonderfull seva.
thank
OK

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fluffy bunny
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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by fluffy bunny » 08 Aug 2012

As I said, I don't recommend anyone does any kind of BK meditation until we work out what is really going on.

It seems to be a practise of self-hypnosis which opens one's mind and subtle body up to psychic influences that are confusing and misleading, and intoxicated the mind ... intoxicates as in "makes drunk" or poisons.

I would encourage people to shut their minds and subtle body down to the influences until we know what they are.

Although I can accept Lekhraj Kirpalani was a far more accomplished human being then most in business and social politics, I don't consider that he is very high or realised in the spiritual world. He was deluded and deluded other and, if we are to accept it is his ghost coming to Madhuban (which I question), continues to deluded others to satisfy his own lust.

The idea that he is the number one human being is ridiculous to me. There is no evidence to suggest it.

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arjun
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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by arjun » 08 Aug 2012

rmn wrote:MR ARJUN , FLUFFY AND BUNNY, MB BHATT, ARJUN AND Shiva SENA. You all thinking that u r elders and want to respect from others, as per Baba's muralis elders should offer younger to come forward. When I asked some one some thing other named person is replying, it is very bad u elders do not have faith on Baba and not giving any guidlines to new commers.
First of all I don't consider myself as elder or senior. As regards giving guidelines to newcomers, fluffy-bunny was trying to guide you in a respectable manner from the day one, but you were trying to be stubborn and making fun of him.

As regards quoting your words addressed to fluffy-bunny, it is not any kind of disrespect. This is a discussion forum and anyone can comment on anybody's words, but in a respectable manner. Everything is public here.
Mr Arjun said to learn how to do Yoga respect Seniors which is not corrrect as per muralis. We have to exchange the views to think and to reach near to Baba by doing extra purushartam.
rmn, please quote the Murli point which says that it is not necessary to respect others.
u all are adopting nick names as such i followed u and i used nick name as rmn. Soul- sita told that used nick name, so I am also accepting I used nick name.
When u were using nickname for yourself how could you make fun of others for using nicknames? Baba says your words and actions should be same (kathani aur karni ek honi chahiye).

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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by arjun » 08 Aug 2012

"Baba aatmaon say baat kartey hain. Aatma na kah jeevatma kahengey kyonki jab aatma akeli hai toh bol nahee saktee. Sharir bigar aatma, aatma say baat nahee kartee. Paramdham may kya Parmatma aatma say baat karengey? Bhal kah detey Christ ko Parmatma nay bheja parantu vahaan Parmatma boltaa nahee hai, vahaan ishara bhi nahee hota. Drama anusaar aatma aapey hee part bajaaney neechey aa jaati hai. Aatma may part bhara hua hai. Toh aatma neechey aakar sharir dhaaran kar part bajaati hai." (BKs dwara prakaashit revised Sakar Murli taareekh 08.10.07, pg 1&2)

“Baba speaks to the souls. Instead of aatma (soul) it will be called a jeevatma (a living soul, i.e. soul+body) because when a soul is single (i.e. without body) it cannot speak. Without a body, a soul does not speak to (another) soul. Will the Supreme Soul talk to a soul in the Supreme Abode? Although it is said that Christ was sent (to Earth) by the Supreme Soul, but there the Supreme Soul does not speak. There is not even gesture there. According to the drama a soul comes down on its own to play its part. The part (i.e. role) is recorded in the soul. So the soul comes down and plays its part by assuming a body.” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 08.10.07, pg 1&2 published by BKs)

- After 1969, BKs are taught that they can go to the Supreme Abode during meditation and talk to ShivBaba. But Baba is Himself asking in the above Murli that will the Supreme Soul talk to the soul in the Supreme Abode? So is it correct to remember ShivBaba as a point of light in the Supreme Abode? Or is it correct to remember the incorporeal Father Shiv who has come in a corporeal Chariot?


PBKs believe that since incorporeal Father Shiv has not gone back to the Supreme abode after 1969 (when Brahma Baba left his body) and is playing His part of establishing a new world through Shankar, as per Shrimat we have to remember the incorporeal Father Shiv through His human Chariot.

rmn

Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by rmn » 08 Aug 2012

My dear soul brother Arjun Bai,. U r derived the discussions had betwenn me and FB. very good keep it up. Reagarding Yoga u quoted Murli points it is very true, then what u have understood and how u r doing Yoga with sweet shivabap pl explain along with u r experiences.
thanks

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arjun
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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by arjun » 09 Aug 2012

rmn,
I have already said that we remember Father Shiv through His corporeal Chariot (believed to be Baba Virendra Dev Dixit by the PBKs).
OGS,
Arjun

rmn

Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by rmn » 09 Aug 2012

Thank very much PBK Arjun Bhai jii, u r the first soul to tell ,"how to do Yoga with sweet baba". But u have not told the u r experiences during Yoga.
thank

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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by fluffy bunny » 09 Aug 2012

arjun wrote:I have already said that we remember Father Shiv through His corporeal Chariot (believed to be Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit by the PBKs).
Does that literally just mean you just remember Virendra Dev Dixit (having the thought that Shiva is inside him also), say, in the same way a lokik person remembers their boyfriend, a movie star or beloved grandmother?

allexx

Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by allexx » 10 Oct 2012

i am trying to find the solution of your problem

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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by Roy » 11 Oct 2012

fluffy bunny wrote:Does that literally just mean you just remember Virendra Dev Dixit (having the thought that Shiva is inside him also), say, in the same way a lokik person remembers their boyfriend, a movie star or beloved grandmother?
Yes, that is exactly how you remember Him! Bhakti souls have Yoga, Gyani souls remember their alokik Father. One is hatha Yoga, the other is easy raj Yoga.

I think souls with powerful Bhakti sanskars, expect powerful experiences every time they "tune in" to Father Shiv. They expect to experience bliss, or some great vision that is going to give them faith in all of this. This is pure Bhakti. Some souls do get such experiences in their early days of Gyan; but i personally have never had any such experiences, and souls should not hanker after them. My faith comes from knowledge, and this has only been strengthened by studying advance knowledge. Remembrance is harder, although i find I am naturally thinking of ShivBaba to some extent, as i study. However, my practise of soul consciousness, and seeing the point form of Father Shiv in the forehead of Prajapita-Ram, is something that continues to take a lot more effort of focused concentration, and this is not a strong point of mine. It is this practise in particular, that creates detachment, and burns your karmas; and ShivBaba tells us in the Murli, that it is in this practise of remembrance that Maya interferes; not in the study of Gyan. Purity is achieved through remembrance not study... study is the tool to help you understand and remember accurately, so that you can burn away your sins(karmas). Without accurate remembrance, you cannot burn your sins.

Some points on this subject... the sections in brackets are my interpretation based on advance knowledge....

“All right, what is the Supreme Soul whom you remember? You say that He is a form of an imperishable light. But He is not like this. It is wrong to remember an imperishable light. Remembrance should be accurate, shouldn’t it? Just gossip will not work. One should know accurately.” [Mu 09.05.71]

"One should not think that ‘our Yoga(link) is only with ShivBaba (the point of light).’ They (who believe this) are BKs only (not PBKs). ShivBaba can give knowledge through Brahma only (yet Dadi Gulzar has never been referred to as Brahma). If you remember only ShivBaba (the point of light), then how will you listen to Murli? Then what will be the result? If you don’t study, then which post will you achieve?” [Mu 17.09.05]

“In this Drama, I enter into his body, who has a part to play, and it is him whom I name Brahma… If I enter someone else, then his name also has to be Brahma.” [Mu 19.03.78]

"Those who remember Father above (in the Soul World, Paramdham) follow the path of worship, because they do not know the occupation. They do not know His name, form, country, and time." [Mu 14.10.68]

"God Shiva is incorporeal; you can love(remember) Him only through a corporeal medium(body). How can you love the Incorporeal? You cannot love the soul once it leaves the body. Love is possible only when the soul & Supreme Soul are present in the physical body. People may sing praises of the incorporeal God, but you cannot love Him." [Mu 01.01.77]

"One must follow the Shrimat at every step. Shrimat is given through Brahma. It is not that He would give advice to anyone through inspiration. Had it been so, then where was the need to produce so many children by coming in this one? Nice old (i.e. senior) children think that they will obtain (the inheritance) directly from ShivBaba (the incorporeal point). They have a lot of body consciousness." [Mu 03.09.07]

"How can one meditate without the (accurate) recognition of God Father(Shiv, in his corporeal or practical living form - the one that shall be revealed to the whole world at the end)?" [Mu 31.12.11]

"Now you remember the living ShivBaba(Father Shiv in His corporel Chariot). Thereafter, when you become worshippers, you will worship stones(non-living images). Now Baba is in living (practical) form, is not it? ShivBaba (the point form) is called Shiva only. Even when He is in this person(Brahma Baba Krishna) He is called ShivBaba. He cannot be given any other name." [Mu 29.02.84]

"If the knowledge (of the part of Father, and his form and role, since 1969) is not fitted in the intellect completely... then one will not be able to do (easy raj)Yoga." [Mu 28.07.76]

"Do not remember any picture whether it is Incorporeal(Nirakar), Corporeal(Sakar) or Subtle(Aakar)." [Mu 02.03.78]

"I am the Ocean of Knowledge but being Incorporeal how can I sit in Paramdham and teach you RajYoga by inspiration. The Incorporeal Father(Shiva) teaches (easy) RajYoga only through the corporeal Father (Prajapita-Ram, not the mother, Brahma Baba)." [Mu 20.08.78]

“The Father says you should not remember any subtle or corporeal or incorporeal picture. You are given a target; people (on the path of Bhakti) remember (God) by seeing pictures. Baba says – stop seeing pictures. This is a path of worship (not knowledge). He says – Children, do not look at any picture. Remember Me alone. Connect the intellect above (i.e. practice being bodiless-soul conscious - but do not go to Soul World, as Father Shiv is not there in the Confluence Age). We have to remember the One where we have to go(Father Shiv in the body of Prajapita-Ram). One Father, that is all, none else. He alone is the true paatshaah, the one who narrates the truth. So, you should not remember any picture. You should not even remember this picture of Shiv because Shiv is not like this. Just as we are souls, He is the Supreme Soul. Just as a soul lives in the middle of the forehead, Baba also says – I occupy a little space adjacent to the soul and sit(i.e. remember Him in His permanent Chariot, Prajapita-Ram). I sit as a charioteer and give knowledge to this one(Brahma Baba, the temporary Chariot of Father Shiv at the time of narration). The soul of this one did not have knowledge; he was sinful. Just as his soul, the charioteer, speaks through the body, similarly I speak through these organs. Otherwise, how would I explain?” [Mu 20.02.08]

“If you remember the picture(the corporeal Chariot, Prajapita Brahma) along with the One who has no picture(Incorporeal Father Shiv), you yourselves will become virtuous. If you remember only the picture(corporeal Prajapita Brahma) and the role, then you will remember only the role. That is why the picture(corporeal Father, Prajapita) and the role should be remembered, along with the one who has no picture(the Incorporeal Father, Shiv).” [Mu 18.01.70]

"Those who remember Father above (in the Soul World) follow the path of worship because they do not know the occupation (i.e. the role of Father Shiv in Prajapita-Ram, the Sun of Knowledge). They do not know his name, form, country, and time." [Mu 14.10.68]

"We souls are brothers; we now have to return home (to Prajapita-Ram). Practise this very firmly. Become bodiless(soul conscious), stabilize yourself in your original religion (of purity) and remember the Father (Shiv; in the corporeal body or home of Prajapita-Ram; not in the Soul World, because He is not there during the Confluence Age)." [Mu 04.02.09]

"One must remember the body (of Prajapita-Ram) and then the soul (of incorporeal Shiv within him)." [Mu 18.03.74]

"If the knowledge (of ShivBaba's form and role) is not fitted in the intellect completely, then one will not be able to do (easy raj)Yoga." [Mu 28.07.76]

"I come in this body here (the temporary Chariot of Brahma Baba-DL) and tell that you have to remember (me) there (in the permanent Chariot of Prajapita-Ram), where you have to go (from) now (on, once Brahma Baba becomes Avyakt). You should not remember (Father Shiv) here (in the body of Brahma Baba, once he has left the body)." [Mu 19.04.78]

"You know that ShivBaba is a point.... OK! If you feel that point is small then house(Chariot) is big, isn’t it? So remember the house (or Chariot, Prajapita-Ram). Baba also stays there." [Mu 04.09.76]

"Destructible objects (like the body of Brahma Baba, the temporary Chariot) are not to be remembered. When a new house(i.e. the body of Prajapita-Ram, the permanent Chariot or mukarrar rath, who will not perish before Heaven-Ramraj has been established) is in construction, the attachment for the old house(Brahma Baba) vanishes. This is the language of the unlimited (Confluence Age) world." [Mu 28.03.76]

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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by arjun » 11 Oct 2012

Roy Bhai,
Thanks for answering fluffy-bunny's question. In fact, I had not read his question until you posted your answer today.
OGS,
Arjun

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Re: WHICH IS CORRECT

Post by Roy » 11 Oct 2012

arjun wrote:Thanks for answering fluffy-bunny's question. In fact, I had not read his question until you posted your answer today.
My pleasure Bhai! I was just catching up with some of the threads, and noticed this very good question by fluffy Bhai, remained unanswered.

You have almost achieved omnipresence Arjun Bhai, but even you cannot be expected to answer every question. :D

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