Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

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sita
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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 28 Jun 2017

6) Again just lie. Murli does not say that ShivBaba takes many births. You may say- "the PBK interpretation is so and so". .
So bhi ek janma kee nahee. ShivBaba ke kitney janmon kee biography hai? Tumko maaloom hai?

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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by mbbhat » 28 Jun 2017

11) Read the whole Murli point. Nowhere it is said ShivBaba, HIMSELF, takes many births. He performs His functions of giving the return, or fruit, of the feelings of His devotees, and grants them visions, during the PERIOD of 63 BIRTHS of the MAIN devotees (who go RIGHT round the Cycle), and NOT during His OWN Births!!!

SM 06-06-2007(1, 2):- "Parampita Parmatma kee biography ko tum jaantey ho. Jo ShivBaba kee biography ko nahee jaantey vah haath uthaao. Sab jaantey hain Parmatma kee jeevan kahani. So bhi ek janma kee nahee. ShivBaba ke kitney janmon kee biography hai? Tumko maaloom hai. Tum jaantey ho ShivBaba ka is drama may kya part hai. Aadi say ant tak unko aur unki biography ko jaantey ho. Barobar Bhaktimarg may jo jis bhaavnaa se Bhakti karthay hain, unkaa evajaa mujhe denaa hota hai. Vah chaitany toh hote naheen. Saakshaatkaar main hee karaathaa hun. Tum jaanthay ho aadhaa kalp Bhaktimarg chaltaa hai. ...... (pg 2) ShivBaba Brahma tann dwaaraa humko sab samjhaa rahe hain. Tum sabkee biography, ShivBaba kee bhee biography jaan_neywaaley ban gaye ho. Toh oonch thah_rey na. Jo shaastr bahut adhyayan karnevaaley hote hain, unkey aage na jaan_neywaaley maathaa thekthay hain. ......... " (Revised Sakar Murli dated 06.06.07, pg 1, 2)

= “You know the biography of the Supreme Father Supreme Soul. Those who do not know the biography of ShivBaba – raise your hands. Everyone knows the life-story of the Supreme Soul. That too, not just of one birth. The biography of ShivBaba’s how many births is available? Do you know? You know as to what is the part of ShivBaba in this drama. You know Him and His biography from the beginning to the end. In the path of Bhakti, I need to give fruit as per the emotions of the devotees. They (the deities being worshiped) would not be in practical (during Bhaktimarg). I only give visions. You know for half a Kalpa Bhaktimarg continues..... ShivBaba explains to us through body of Brahma. You know biographies of all, including even ShivBaba. So- you are great, is it not. Those who do not know about scriptures, bow to those who have studied scriptures well. ” (Revised Sakar Murli dated 06.06.07, pg 1, 2)

Baba clearly says- I give visions, etc in Bhaktimarg. Where is is said- AUTOMATIC or MANY BIRTHs of ShivBaba, HIMSELF? CLEARLY, God is referring here, NOT to His OWN Births, but to the functions which He performs, DURING the PERIOD of the number of births, taken by the MAIN devotees (who go RIGHT round the Cycle). So, the BLIND PBKs, with INVERTED intellects, have ERRONEOUSLY ASSUMED this refers to 'births' of ShivBaba, due to which they have ERRONEOUSLY ASSUMED 'ShivBaba' refers to their bodily guru, -Virendra Dev Dixit - thus carrying out the 'shooting' of HiranyaKashyap!

So- better speak truth instead of speaking lies. Mention clearly that- "we/PBKs have TOTALLY NEGLECTED/OVERLOOKED/DISMISSED the very ADJACENT SENTENCES.. and added few words like AUTOMATIC" - (which is COMPLETELY out of context, as per the adjacent sentences).

Why speak lies, dear? Do you also like to take part in Mr. Dixit's lies?

sita
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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 28 Jun 2017

Sab jaantey hain Parmatma kee jeevan kahani. So bhi ek janma kee nahee.
Everyone knows the biography. Biography - jivan kahani. Story of the life. Means one must be living, living means in a body, a soul becomes living in a body. And that also not of one birth. Here the word birth is used. Not one birth. If not one then how many. More than one. Is there a third option that it is not one and not many and still it is birth and still it is story of the life?
7) There is benefit. Baba says- 21 janmon kaa praalabhd ka aadhaar hai 63 janmon kee Bhakti. Unless one does Bhakti, he cannot get gyaan.
That is fine. The bakti performed in 63 births becomes basis for the knowledge we get in Sangamyug, but what is the role there of God in people doing bhaki? People are doing Bhakti based on their own mind, that is why it is called path of degradation.
Where is is said- AUTOMATIC or MANY BIRTHs?
No, the word automatic is not used. It is indeed said that I give vision. But is there a biography and birth in this giving visions?

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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by mbbhat » 28 Jun 2017

sita wrote:Everyone knows the biography. Biography - jivan kahani. Story of the life. Means one must be living, living means in a body,a soul becomes living in a body. And that also not of one birth.Here the word birth is used. Not one birth. If not one then how many. More than one. Is there a third option that it is not one and not many and still it is birth and still it is story of the life?
12) Baba has not said - just one birth. Baba has said "one birth, plus Bhaktimarg part of giving visions, etc. (in the adjacent sentences) ".

Nowhere it is said "many births".

13) Meaning of biography need not be always in living body. It can also mean PART. Baba does not or need not speak literally. There are many such examples, already given to you. in the topic - Flaws in PBK philosophy. Type for rejuvenation in the topic and see.

------------
14) BTW- Even if PBKs like to take assume the point as MANY BIRTHS and apply it for the Chariot, it can applies to B Baba. How does the point support to Mr. Dixit?

But, if PBKs claim the Murli point is said to the Chariot, then Murli point says - My part negins from Bhaktimarg. Then obviously, the no. of births would be lower!

And- PBKs can never explain the adjacent sentences there.

So- even if PBKs try to (mis) interpret by hook or crook, they do not gain anything.

sita
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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 28 Jun 2017

13) Meaning of biography need not be always in living body. It can also mean PART. Baba does not or need not speak literally. There are many such examples, already given to you. in the topic - Flaws in PBK philosophy. Type for rejuvenation in the topic and see.
What about the words "birth", "births". "Not just one birth." "How many births"? Is it that for a birth also living and a body is not needed?
That too, not just of one birth. The biography of ShivBaba’s how many births is available?
So, you say it means his coming in Sangamyug + his role after the Copper Age. This is the meaning of not just one birth?

The word "birth" is indeed used for ShivBaba. His birth and the birth of children takes at the same time. It is about revelation like birth. In the Copper Age God is not revealed and his children are not revealed, because there is no knowledge at that time.


= RESPONSE =

For better comprehension of above MISAPPROPRIATION, CONCERNED Viewers may kindly review the UPGRADED earlier post, in this topic, above, - in link below -
viewtopic.php?f=2&p=53093#p53090
and may also review the post in another topic, regarding same, in link below -
viewtopic.php?f=40&t=2602&p=53083#p53083

Dear Div Bro mbbhat,
Whereas, we DEFINITELY DO APPRECIATE, your EXTREME PATIENCE and RESOURCEFULNESS, and your DEDICATED COMMITMENT and PERSEVERANCE, we feel obligated to bring to your kind notice, that it is IMPOSSIBLE to CONVINCE another soul, whose Spiritual Intellectual Frequency is EVIDENTLY 180 degrees OUT of PHASE with yours, and make that soul COMPREHEND the particular aspects of the Murli, (which are understood to be the SUBTLER aspects by you) in the VERY SAME MANNER, in which you are able to COMPREHEND SAME, quite easily. LIKEWISE, it would be IMPOSSIBLE (and EXTREMELY FRUSTRATING TOO) for another soul, to make you COMPREHEND the particular aspects of the Murli, (which are understood by that soul to be the 'unlimited clarifications' of the Murli), in the VERY SAME MANNER, in which that particular soul is able to COMPREHEND SAME, quite easily. In this context, it would also be prudent to bring to your kind attention that overlooking this factor, and continuing to 'bother' ANOTHER soul relentlessly, in that PARTICULAR VEIN of VIGOROUSLY EXPECTING that soul to READILY ACCEPT your point of view, would not be considered to be exercising due compassion with due discretion, towards such a soul.

Dear Div Bro Sita,
We would ALSO like to take this opportunity, to EQUALLY APPRECIATE, the EXTREME PATIENCE and RESOURCEFULNESS, and the DEDICATED COMMITMENT and PERSEVERANCE, with which you feel obligated to DEFEND your particular viewpoints, as readily understood by you, in accordance with the natural tendency of your intellect, and as propagated by AIVV.

We would like to present here, a simple example, which may more easily illustrate the ground reality of this EWD Play. Assuming that the SEED of the Tree has ESSENTIALLY to give the Knowledge through an embodied soul, one may EITHER be INFLUENCED MORE, by the SEED ONLY, or the instrumental embodied soul ONLY.
The REAL SEED motivates CERTAIN souls to give PROMINENCE to the SEED ONLY, and forget the instrument (Brahma Baba) - ONLY keep him in the AWARENESS, as an INSTRUMENT ONLY, but DO NOT Remember him - through whom the 'shooting' of the 'Day of Brahma' or the 'Day of the Cycle' occurs - we may use the TOP PART of EVERY LEAF of the Tree to represent the COMPREHENSION of EVERY POINT of Knowledge, in the ORIGINAL PERSPECTIVE of the REAL SEED.
The APPARENT SEED of the SAME Tree, THEN motivates CERTAIN OTHER souls to give due PROMINENCE to the INSTRUMENT - DELUSIVELY believing that the REAL SEED is within THAT instrument - (-Virendra Dev Dixit) - through whom the 'shooting' of 'Night of Brahma' or the 'Night of the Cycle' occurs - we may use the BOTTOM PART of EVERY LEAF of the VERY SAME Tree to represent the COMPREHENSION of EVERY POINT of the VERY SAME Knowledge, in the REVERSED PERSPECTIVE of the REAL SEED.

If the above DIFFERENCE & CONTRAST is appreciated by concerned souls, the NEGATIVE ENERGY would tend to get diluted gradually, and the interactions would then become progressively more amicable.

sita
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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 01 Jul 2017

About the Shivling, if Baba comes to make us equal to himself, what does it mean. Does it mean that he will make us points of lights in Paramdham? Certainly to leave body consciousness is not the same as leaving the body. The souls will have to become pure means that they will have to leave the consciousness of the body, whist in the body, because we can leave the body with body consciousness too. The stage of the Father is of being free from body consciousness, even whilst being in a body. Souls are souls in Paramdham anyway. Yes, he has come to take us back, but first we will bring Paramdham to this world. Have we completed that task?

If taking souls back home was a matter of leaving the body, there would be no need and time for effort. Souls could just leave bodies, but we practice to become pure, that is to be in a stage that is equal to the Father. It is equal to the Father because the Father comes and has a stage whilst in a body. So that equal stage of his has to be visible here on earth, because there are memorials of the Confluence Age of what happens here and now, and there are no memorials of Paramdham or Golden Age, because the memorials are memorials of effort. Here are memorials of the masters of the world, who become masters through effort – Lakshmi and Narayan, but this memorial is not the memorial of the Bap saman stage, because the Father is not a deity. For Lakshmi and Narayan it is easy to accept that in the temples we worship our past and future perfect forms. But the temples of the shivling are found the most. Why would this also not be a memorial of perfect form of a human.

Shivling is there worshiped along with the saligrams. We know that the saligrams are memorials of the incorporeal stage of the souls. Incorporeal stage is a complete stage and that stage is the stage that is equal to the incorporeal Father. Souls are number wise and the saligrams are memorials of the souls who are number wise, who have bondages and the shivling is the memorial of the one who plays highest stage in incorporeal, free from bondage, central, greatest part equal to the Father. It is a memorial of effort.


= RESPONSE =

CONCERNED, interested viewers may like to review points 1, 5 & 8 of Rev SM dated 01.07.2017, in post dated 01.07.2017, in link below - which is SELF-EXPLANATORY - but ONLY for THOSE with Satopradhan intellects - as CLEARLY CLARIFIED, by God, HIMSELF -
viewtopic.php?f=40&p=53105#p53105

sita
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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 01 Jul 2017

which is SELF-EXPLANATORY
Some of your explanations to me seem like condemnation and judgement.


= RESPONSE =

APPEARANCES can be DECEPTIVE, and are ALWAYS governed by the COLOURED PERCEPTIONS of the observer!
WONDERFUL DRAMA!

sita
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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 02 Jul 2017

APPEARANCES can be DECEPTIVE, and are ALWAYS governed by the COLOURED PERCEPTIONS of the observer!
WONDERFUL DRAMA!
That is true to some limit. We are all bound to perceive through our own personal lens of past experiences and sanskars, attitude, perceptions and dispositions etc., but still there will be twist to some limit. We cannot interpret a reality just as we wish. If I perceive something there is also a good chance for it to be a reality. That is why it is good that someone else also shares his impressions, or double check. To me your posts are very condemning and judgmental, you say the problem is with me. This is possible, but you also have to think a bit. Maybe there is some truth in what I say too.


= RESPONSE =

When the IGNORANT & ARROGANT, 'MAHA-MURKH' bodily guru of the PBKs, -Virendra Dev Dixit, TREACHEROUSLY implies that the head of a donkey shown on top of the head of Ravan, pertains to Brahma Baba - (when, in FACT, it ACTUALLY pertains to his own self) - would that be considered to be 'condemning and judgmental' -
of BOTH, the REAL 'mukrar-rath' of God, Brahma Baba, AS WELL AS, God, HIMSELF???

If the ACTUAL TRUTH is CLARIFIED, by using the Pure Versions of God, and providing their UNADULTERATED UNLIMITED CLARIFICATIONS, for the SOLE benefit of ALL embodied souls, with GENUINE FEELINGS of COMPLETE COMPASSION towards them, and with the SOLE purpose of DELIVERING them from the VERY CLAWS & JAWS of Ravan, (MASQUERADING as RAMA), would that ALSO be considered to be 'condemning and judgmental' ???

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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 03 Aug 2017

In one of the latest AV it was said that over the murti of Baba there is also a rosary. If we look at the Trimurti, there are rosaries over Vishnu and Shankar.

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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 14 Aug 2017

One is a rosary of flowers and the other is rosary of rudraksh. About which Baba is speaking. It is said that the souls of the whole world become beads of the rosary of Rudra. Because God is God to all, but Vishnu does not sustain all. He sustains only the deities. Not all souls become of the rosary of Vishnu.

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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 16 Aug 2017

In the Murli it is said that when the rust from the soul is removed, the children will study directly from the Father. This was wrongly interpreted to mean that when the children become soul-conscious they will be able to catch the touchings of the Father. But this is wrong, because Baba has said that I don't teach by inspiration, I teach through the mouth. And Baba has said 10 years before, about the revelation like birth of that Father from which the children will study directly. In 1966 the birth of Lakshmi and Narayan got declared for 1976. Lakshmi and Narayan are the mother and Father of the world. So it is about the human Father through whom the children study directly since 1976.They are having their class transferred, and the school and the teacher and even the study change. For this new school Baba has instructed in the Murli to name it Adyatmik Vidyalay instead of Brahma Kumaris Vidyalay. And the new teacher is the Father, because in this study the Father is also the teacher and the Satguru in one. Before this the study is there through the mother Brahma, who is not the teacher or Satguru. In the worldly life also children receive basic education from their mothers at home. But the teachers task of explanation the depth of the meaning of the Murli is through some other personality.

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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by mbbhat » 17 Aug 2017

sita wrote:In the Murli it is said that when the rust from the soul is removed, ...
PBKs claim their Confluence Age Narayan is the only intelligent one. All the rest of the Narayans of Golden Age are fools. And, PBKs claim their Confluence Age Narayan took birth in 1976.

But, from the data available, Mr. Dixit had done countless mistakes, which have already been proved and shown. The so-called INTELLIGENT Confluence Age Narayan of A(I)VV had believed, and (inadvertently) certified the name SEVAKRAM until at least 2008, and just recently, they have removed that name from their dictionary.

So- can we say- the PBK Narayan is intelligent one? And- funny thing is - Sita soul claims name Sevakram had been taken wrongly by some PBKs! - but Mr. Dixit had (inadvertently) certified* it! - :laugh:
So- in AIVV is the Father getting (at least a few) teachings from the children (at least till 2008?) -
More details - Flaw No. 557 onwards-
viewtopic.php?f=39&t=2099&p=53246&sid=7 ... 852#p53210

* - But actually, it is almost evident that it is Mr. Dixit who had first suggested it. So- it just proves that PBK Narayan is the most foolish one.

sita
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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 17 Aug 2017

but Mr. Dixit had (inadvertently) certified it!
Where has he certified it?

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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by mbbhat » 18 Aug 2017

sita wrote:Where has he certified it?
Mr. Dixit has used it, means he has INADVERTENTLY certified it.

Mostly, it is Mr. Dixit who has first taken that name from the Bk comic book. So- it is as good as Mr. Dixit took teachings from BKs as well - (it again proves that Mr. Dixit has no ability to do churning from the Murli points), he fell into the pit by taking the support/teaching of BK comic book.

So- from all dimensions/ways, the so-called PBK intelligent Narayan proved that his intellect is the most foolish one, as well as he took teachings from others (not just churned from Murli points).

BTW, PBKs claim- during Q and A discussion with his students/followers, there would be God sitting in the body of Mr. Dixit. So- PBK God failed to notice the error and continued to use the name Sevakram, till AT LEAST 2008!

What a pitiable state! But, as per drama, it is fine, and nothing wrong.

sita
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Re: Supporting Murli points for PBKs(AK)

Post by sita » 24 Aug 2017

Mr. Dixit has used it
Please, present some evidence where he has used it.
Mostly, it is Mr. Dixit who has first taken that name from the BK comic book. So- it is as good as Mr. Dixit took teachings from BKs as well - (it again proves that Mr. Dixit has no ability to do churning from the Murli points), he fell into the pit by taking the support/teaching of BK comic book.

So- from all dimensions/ways, the so-called PBK intelligent Narayan proved that his intellect is the most foolish one, as well as he took teachings from others (not just churned from Murli points).
There is difference between the spiritual and worldy knowledge. When Avyakt BapDada asks about the service of the children is he taking knowledge from them. There is nothing wrong in studying the history of the Yagya from worldly sources for to know it in a worldly way. There is no other way to obtain such information. It won't come to us in meditation.

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